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Författare Ämne: Help with translation of 1757 death record  (läst 189 gånger)

2020-06-28, 20:11
läst 189 gånger

Utloggad Victoria Cihla

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Attached is a copy of a 1757 death record.  I've highlighted the record I would like help with.  Can someone confirm/correct my translation? 

https://app.arkivdigital.se/volume/v30538?image=85

22nd April died and ? May buried Erik Pärsson's wife Karin Månsdotter in Kånna Arvidsgården 6? years old, died of pneumonia (Håll och styng). 

I'm not sure if burial was 2 May or 1 May and her age was 61 or 62.

Any help would be much appreciated.

Thank you,

Vicki Cihla



2020-06-28, 22:54
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Utloggad Yvonne Stenberg

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She was buried 1st of May - a sunday, which is usually the day people were buried in those days. She was 61 years old.
/Yvonne

2020-06-28, 23:05
Svar #2

Utloggad Victoria Cihla

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Thanks very much!  I hadn't heard that before about Sunday burials which is very interesting. 

Can you confirm the rest of the translation is correct?  Her name and that she is the wife of Erik Persson? 

Thanks again,

Vicki Cihla

2020-06-28, 23:23
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Utloggad Victoria Cihla

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Can anyone confirm the name of the person who died that she is the wife of Erik Persson? 

I am trying to establish the name of the wife of Erik Persson.  I know she died at Arvidsgården in Kånna in 1757 because Erik Persson is listed as a widower beginning in the tax record for 1758. 

If anyone can confirm the rest of my translation, I would really appreciate it!

Thanks,

Vicki Cihla

2020-06-28, 23:42
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Utloggad Kalle Birgersson

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She was the wife of Erik Tömeqvist, which could also be Erik Persson
 

2020-06-28, 23:56
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Utloggad Yvonne Stenberg

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According to Centrala Soldatregistret there was a soldier Erik Törnqvist, but unfortunately no family name is stated, and if so he lived in Dragaryd Backegård at the time. I cite:



TÖRNQVIST ErikSläktnamn: -
Född: 1698
Död: -
Antagen: 1716
Avsked: 1739
Aktnummer: SU-K5-0052-1716Regemente: Smålands kavalleriregemente
Rote: Dragaryd Backagård
Kompani: SUNNERBO KOMPANI
Socken: KÅNNA
Torpnummer: SU-K5-0052


This needs to be more researched I think, but it is possible that he is the same person. Perhaps the tax records show that he moved when he left the army?
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/Yvonne[/font]
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2020-06-28, 23:59
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Utloggad Yvonne Stenberg

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Sorry about that, I don't know what happened to the size.


Erik Persson and Törnqvist might be the same person, the age is correct, but you need to research a bit more. Maybe the tax records show that he moved from Dragaryd Backegård to Kånna Arvidsgård.
/Yvonne

2020-06-29, 00:18
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Utloggad Victoria Cihla

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Thanks for this information.  I have checked the tax registers all the way back through 1746 and he is listed there with his wife (name unknown).  So I don't know where he might have come from. 

I have all the links to his tax registers from 1746-1764 and he is always listed as Erik Persson.

So, it must not be his wife that I found.  I will look further!

Thanks so much for your help!

Vicki Cihla

2020-06-29, 01:00
Svar #8

Utloggad Victoria Cihla

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There is another death record on the same page - the first listing under 1757 - that I also thought might be his wife's death record.  However, I was looking for Kånna Arvidsgården instead of Dragaryd Arvidsgården so I thought it would not be the one.

https://app.arkivdigital.se/volume/v30538?image=85

The 1758 record is the first one who lists him as a widower, with daughters:

https://sok.riksarkivet.se/bildvisning/A0001540_00392#?c=&m=&s=&cv=391&xywh=3278%2C1616%2C2893%2C1334

I'd appreciate your thoughts on what else I should be checking.  I have all the tax links beginning with 1746 (the first available records) and he is listed from 1746 until his son-in-law takes over in 1765.   Erik's wife was sickly and sometimes was not included for tax obligation but then would appear a year or two later.  But, the first time he is listed as a widower was on the 1758 tax register. 

Not sure where to go next.

I would appreciate any help anyone can offer,

Vicki Cihla

2020-06-29, 01:23
Svar #9

Utloggad Victoria Cihla

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Maybe the question I should ask is: Do you think they would refer to Erik Persson as Erik Törnqvist on the 1757 death record for his wife?  He was released from service in 1739.  And, he was referred to as Erik Persson on his own death record in 1778.

However, his death record was the only record I've seen Erik Persson except for the tax entries from 1746-1764.  It does seem very possible, though, that this is the same person as Erik Törnqvist, just because the dates are right on.  There are no household exam records, birth records or marriage records available for that timeframe.  I will look at the general muster rolls to see if I can find any connection.

Otherwise, am I at the end of the line on this one? 

Any help would be much appreciated, as always!

Vicki Cihla

2020-06-29, 08:33
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Utloggad Ulf Svensson

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2020-06-29, 11:13
Svar #11

Utloggad Yvonne Stenberg

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The muster rolls only show Erik's soldier name.


1764 June 11 Jonas Arvidsson, parish tailor, marries Elin Eriksdotter in Kånna Arvidsgård. Their first child 1764 is named Arvid (no doubt after his father). Their second child 1766 is named Karin (possibly after Elin's mother?), and their third child 1769 is named Måns (Elin's maternal grandfather?). That would be following traditional naming rules. I have not followed the names of Jonas parents/grandparents.


A wife Karin Månsdotter in Kånna Arvidsgård is witness at some christenings 1743-ish.


There might be more clues like that, or of course in the legal documents but then you will have to go through maybe thousands of pages with old writing, if they are att all digitalized yet.


/Yvonne


2020-06-29, 14:38
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Utloggad Victoria Cihla

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Thanks, Yvonne!

I knew that Erik Persson's daughter, Elin, married Jonas Arvidsson.  I also knew that his daughter Elin's first 2 children were named Arvid and Karin - this made it seem likely that Karin Månsdotter might be the wife of Erik Persson. 

I also know that Erik Persson died in 1778 at age 80, which indicates he, like Erik Törnqvist, was also was born in 1698.

What I didn't know was that he had a son named Måns born in 1769!!   I also did not know that Jonas Arvidsson was a parish tailor!!  I have a copy of their marriage record - did I miss it on there? It is at https://app.arkivdigital.se/volume/v30538?image=72   Can you tell me where you found this information?

I think it is reasonable to believe that Erik Persson and Erik Törnqvist are one and the same person, but I probably will never have absolute proof (as I cannot read through the many pages of old legal documents.)   :)  I will make this notation in my records.

Thanks again for your ongoing help!  It is very much appreciated!

Vicki Cihla

2020-06-29, 15:11
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Utloggad Yvonne Stenberg

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From the marriage note 1764: "d: 11 Junii eller Feria 11:te Pentecostes wigdes SochenSkräddaren drängen Jonas Arwidsson och Pigan Elin Eriksdotter uti Kånna Arwidsgd".
i.e. On 11th of June or Feria 11th Pentecostes were married the parish tailor young man Jonas Arwidsson and the young woman Elin Erik's daughter in Kånna Arvidsgård.


If it is a small parish to look in it can be useful to browse through the marriages, births and deaths notices as they are not so many. If it is a large parish I might start with the Kronoberg Genealogiska Förening's database (also available on Arkiv Digital in a simpler form, I use the CD) to sort out possible matches and then look for the original notes in the church records from that. The database contains many reading errors and is not complete at all for that part of Kronoberg, but of help anyway. The KGF database you find under the Register button. Choose Födda/born (or vigda/married or dead/döda), delar av Sverige/part of Sweden. Then you have to experiment by typing f ex Kånna Arvidsgård or a year and name etc. You will make it.
/Yvonne


2020-06-29, 15:30
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Utloggad Victoria Cihla

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Yvonne,

I found the record for their son Måns so I thank you for that information!  I also missed asking about the note on the marriage record!  I’ll add it to my notes!

There is something interesting about the death record for the father, Jonas Arvidsson, it looks like his death record is for 2 people: Jonas Arvidsson age 52 and his son Arvid Jonasson age 19. Both died from dysentery.

https://app.arkivdigital.se/volume/v30538?image=97      (it is the first entry at top of right hand page)

Am I correct in my understanding?

Thanks so much for all of the help, it is all very interesting,

Vicki Cihla

2020-06-29, 15:57
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Utloggad Yvonne Stenberg

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Yes you read correctly:
From the 1784 book of dead: d: 10 octob: Jordf: Jonas Arwidsson och des son Arwid Jonasson ifrån Kånna Arvidsgd: döde af rödsoten, den förra 52 år och den sednare 19 år".
i.e. O Oct 10th were buried Jonas Arwidsson and his son Arwid Jonasson from Kånna Arvidsgård, died of dysentery, the former 52 years and the latter 19 years old.


/Yvonne


2020-06-29, 16:00
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Utloggad Victoria Cihla

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Thank you so much for confirming this.  Wow.  That must have been a sad day.

Vicki Cihla

 

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