Patterson-What is the swedish name?

[Colleen Wiggins]

I am seaching for my great grandfather Laurence Patterson, he was born in Gotland/Stockholm Sweden in c.1846 and immigrated to Australia c.1875. His father was William Patterson.  Any help would be great!
 
Thanks
 
Colleen

[Steve Palmquist]

Well Colleen Wiggins, I can try partly to answer your question about their swedish names, Patterson used to be derived from Pettersson (the son of Petter) a Patronymicon (which earlier were changed from generation to generation from father to son or if it was a girl, it should in this case, with Petter, be Pettersdotter). If I have to guess Laurence could be derived from Lars but there are of course other possibilities. Lars was a very common name at the time. What confuses me a bit is that still normaly in mid 19?s century, Laurence Patterson?s father should have given his first name as a patronymicon to his son! William Pattersson could have had the name Wilhelm, then his son would have been named Wilhelmsson but that is not the case here. Maybe their family had been extremely early to freeze the patronymicon and kept it as a surname from generation to generation? Or they just choosed to take a completely different name when they/he arrived to Australia? Did his father William Patterson follow his son to Australia or did he stay at Gotland? Maybe there are more ideas from others about the names, aswell as people who would like to help you to try to find your ancestors at Gotland. I am living in Denmark myself so unfortunately i can?t reach the archives. Good Luck!
Sincerely Yours:

[Colleen Wiggins]

Steve,
 
Thankyou for your help.  I think I need to learn a little more about swedish names.  I am yet to find out exactly how Lawrence came to Australia, not sure where he came from, whether he came directly from Sweden or if he went to America or England first and who he was travelling with, if any.
His mother's name was Mary Alster which sounds fairly english to me.  I will have to establish when he came into the country before I can go any further.  I have done searches in Australian shipping indexes but not having much success.  Do you know how I could do a search for his name or swedish name in Sweden  to obtain his birth certificate.  
 
Thanks
 
Colleen

[Steve Palmquist]

I can see that Ted Roswall answered you under  one of the other questions you had, check that it sounds like a possible candidate! I do not know how to find birth certificate in Sweden from that time. I live in Denmark since many yearsand haven?t done this genealogical search for so long time yet, but maybe att Landsarkiv or Riksarkiv (The Central Arquives of the swedish administrations etc.) probably someone else here at Rötter know how to get into them from abroad? There was a village mentioned today here at Rötter (which means roots as you probably know) called Alster. I can?t get out now and check it. But search for Alster at the the search engine.  
Mary could have had the name Maria or Marie etc. But I agree Mary Alster sounds more English. If they were sailors it could possibly be a connection. In my fathers family they often married overseas because all of them were out sailing during their youth and then some of them met their wifes that way.
Best regards and good luck: Steve

[Colleen Wiggins]

Steve,
Thanks for your help. I searched the search engine for 'Alster' but have difficulty understanding swedish.  Still searching to see what ship Lawrence came into Australia.  Do you know what ships would have left Odvalls in Linde or how I could get this information?  I have found an entry of a ship coming into Queensland, Aust. called the Loch Katrine, which shows a Laurence Patterson aged 19 in 1875 but no other listings.  
 
Regards
 
Colleen

[Steve Palmquist]

Sorry i didn?t think about that you do not understand swedish...grin. I see if I can find out something about Alste that could be relevant. But maybe he met his wife Mary Alster in Australia and she was perhaps of british origin? I do not know so much about emigration to Australia I?m afraid. the emigration to U:S. is more discussed so there I have mor general knowledge. Odvalls in Linde, where is that? Do you mean Uddevalla?  
Sometimes they took to England to change for another ship, and also Bremen in Germany is known as a place where some swedish emigrants changed ships for further destinations.  
But there are probably some reliable experts at here at Rötter, who know more details about that or other alternatives. If you are sure that your great grandfathers was born 1846, then he must have been about 29 1875. But 19 could have been a wrong notation? 19 instead of 29, maybe?  
well i?ll see what I can found out about Alster.
Best wishes: Steve

[Steve Palmquist]

Hi again Colleen. After reading throw the discussions under the village Alster I have unfortunately not found any new information that refers to Mary Alster.  
Alster is a smaller village in Värmland (a province in the south west part of Sweden, close to the border of south Norway, not that far from the Norwegian capital Oslo if you like to find it.  
I put a question for you in Swedish, I hope it is OK? Where I asked for a possible Mary Alster from Alster...hope somebody from that part of Sweden sees it and can help you further in this matter. There are some references to church records in these discussions under Alster, that can be interesting for you if some people from that parish can look it up for you in these records. It seems like it is published on CD-rom aswell.
Best wishes: Steve

[Steve Palmquist]

Hi
There is a lady called Mary Alster but she is born in the 20?s century and is not Australian. But it seems like there are a family (or several families?) with that surname in Sweden maybe they have the origin in the village Alster. i have sent a question to a Mr Alster and let us see if he will have an answer about the origins of the family and maybe there were another Mary Alster. I know that in the 20th century english name forms became more popular, but there are of course also people earlier in Sweden that have had for example Mary as their christian name.
Hope for the best!
Steve

[Klara Björkman]

Steve.
Som gotlänning lägger jag mig i er diskussion utan att vara inblandad, mer än att jag läste att du inte visste var Odvalls Linde är beläget. Linde är en socken, på Gotland, nära Hemse, och Odvalds är ett gårdsnamn i den socknen. Gotland nämns ju också i början av er brevväxling.

[Steve Palmquist]

Nej vad bra Klara Björkman. Tack! Så ska jag väl översätta detta här! Colleen Wiggins, Mrs. Klara Björkman says that Linde is/was a socken (it is the old word for commune) at Gotland it is close to a bigger commune, and village called Hemse (which probably is easier to find on a map) Odvalds is the name of a farm in that commune Linde. So it wasn?t a harbour! but maybe his place of birth? Mrs Klara Björkman is from Gotland, so she is the expert of the region!  
Than you Mrs Klara Björkman good lucke Colleen Wiggins: Steve Palmquist

[Steve Palmquist]

Thank You and Good Luck! It should be, sorry about that!

[Jenny Söderström]

I'm afraid the Odvalls, Linde issue rather demonstrates why the rules here at Anbytarforum state that the same query should not be posted in more than one place in the forum. I happen to have seen Colleen's other posts, so I know that she does not have anything linking her Laurence Patterson to Linde parish on Gotland. It was Ted Rosvall who did a look-up in the Emibas database for her, finding a Laurentius Pettersson emigrating from Odvalls in Linde. It is of course only a very uncertain possibility that this would indeed be the right man, it's more or less impossible to say, seeing that Colleen has so little and conflicting information regarding Laurence Patterson. Should it however be of interest, a map of the parishes of Gotland can be found  here. Linde is not situated by the coast and has no harbour, the Emibas database does not give the exit harbour, but the place where the emigrant was living when reporting to the parish officials that he/she intended to emigrate.
 
About acquiring a birth certificate, we do not have birth certificates in Sweden and never had them. Records of births, marriages, deaths and much more were kept in the parish, and these records are available on microfiche and sometimes also scanned and made available through a private company (Genline) on the Internet. In order to find something in these records, it is absolutely crucial to know what parish the person was living in. There are databases now, such as Emibas, that are meant to be a help in locating that very information, but it would seem that not enough is known about Laurence Patterson in order to locate him in a database. I'm afraid I don't know how to proceed in this case, if more information can not be found in Australia about Laurence Patterson's origin.

[Steve Palmquist]

We agree with this lady, don´t we? let us find more results! ....(på samma gång förstår jag att ni inte vill hjälpa, en frågare! och det är ju jävligt synd om det skulle var så? Jenny Söderström?!)  
So, Colleen try to find some more information as this lady asks for!!! She seems to be one of these people who do not want to help and that is the general or rather dominating fight we are going through here at the moment!!!!!! Unfortunately!  
Sincerely Yours:
Steve

[Anne-Lee Wilson]

Dear Colleen,
 
I am sorry to say that there are not many church books for Gotland available on Genline(the private company Jenny wrote about)on the Internet.
There are only birth/wedding/death 1860-1860 and 1861-1861.
I live far away from Gotland and know nothing about the area.
 
I also thought about Laurence's mother's last name,Alster.
Maybe it's a taken name and her family came from Alster parish???
There is one parish in Sweden named Alster in Värmlands Län.
Then there are also places(villages?) named Alster in:
Kalmar Län
Kronobergs Län
Värmlands Län(2 places)
 
Do not hesitate to e-mail me if you have questions or find more info about Laurence.
I am one of them that likes to help others in their genealogy research or other things in life!
 
Best Wishes,
Anne-Lee Wilson in Malmö.
anne-leewilson@telia.com

[Peter Karlsson / anbytarvärd (Peter)]

..who do not want to help.. - nu får du väl ge dig Steve..! Ovanstående direkta påhopp [22.03] kvalificerar sig visserligen för borttag av mig; men jag skriver nu här istället. Allt och alla är inte emot dig; ha det i åtanke och spar på invektiven.
 
Att inlägg kommer under flera rubriker ställer ofta till besvärlig dubbeldiskussion; så det är bara bra om man påtalar att det inte skall ske.
 
[Excuse the swedish - but this was off-topic..]

[Colleen]

Thankyou all for your info. I am new to using the Gen. Society for Sweden and have posted a couple of other queries which may have created some confusion.  Sorry!  I agree I shall have to search more in Australia to find out when Laurence came into the country and where from.  All I have at present is marriage certicate in 1883 he was 37, (born in 1846) at Gotland, Sweden, his parents were William Patterson a stonemason and mother Mary Alster.  His death certificate (1902) born in Stockholm, Sweden, and in Australia for 26 years.  Age at death 65 years in 1902 (born in 1837).  I would be more reliant on Gotland as this was when Laurence was alive.
Well, I will keep searching and post you when I have some more information.
 
Thanks again!
 
Colleen

[Steve Palmquist]

Sorry, Jenny Söderström! I did misunderstand you completely! Ursäkta också Peter att Du ska behöva uppta din tid på det. det var inte meningen. Jag försöker spara på krutet och invektiverna m.m.  
Jag har nu aldrig upplevt det som om de där debatter handlade om min person, men om motsatta hållningar til vad som är relevanta frågor etc. men det har ju inte att göra med det här. Så, min oförbehållna ursäkt till Jenny och Peter!
M.V.H. Steve

[Steve Palmquist]

The contact with the Alster family through a homepage and e-mail led to the following: No there are just one Mary Alster in this family and the family took their name around 1860 after a member of the family had made his military service as i understood it close to or in the Alster village in Värmland. My contact also added that he knew it also was a quite common name in Germany.  
Mary doesn?t sound that German though but it can have been changed. there was quite a big imigration from Germany to Sweden in the past.Sweden also had provinces in the north of nowadays Germany and Poland.  
I did a mistake in another message att Rötter mixing up Mary as being the wife to Laurence when she was his mother. But that didn?t change the results fotunately of my earlier message. I can see you?ve find another place to continue searching. That is great. Hope you find your ancestors soon. Good Luck!
Sincerely Yours: Steve

[Colleen]

Steve,
 
Thankyou for trying about Mary Alster, at least I have learn't a little more about Sweden.   I visited the city library today and searched the  indexes for Qld immigrants and have previously searched other states, but come up with no results.  So I am up the creek without a paddle, as we say in Australia.  If you come up with any information on  laurence patterson/ laurentius,lars pettersson I would appreciate any further help.
 
Thanks
 
Colleen

[Steve Palmquist]

Great I will remember that Colleen! I often search both in Sweden and Germany, so that possibility I will also check.  
Vem kan ro utan åror? could maybe be close to up the creek without a paddle in swedish? But it is from a folksong from Åland (swedish speaking islands and territory between Sweden and Finland).  
have a good search: Steve