How to find parents of a soldier ?

[Stein Rypern]

Hi --  
 
 I have a specific problem, but the underlying method problem might also be interesting for other non-Swedish researchers.
 
 I am trying to find the parents of a man named Carl Johan Kron. In the 1860s and 1870s, Carl Johan Kron lived at the farm Svås Väster Södergård in Veta socken (parish) in Östergötland.  
 
 He was a soldier - to be precise : he was a life grenadier in the Stångebro company of the Göta life guards. Kron was his soldier name - ie the unique (within his company) name he was assigned when joining the army.
 
 The farm he lived on at this time was according to husforhörslägd 1876-1886 (GID 406.27.55100) farm no 264 in Veta. It was assigned to whoever was soldier no 70 of Stångebro Company of the G?ta life guards regiment.
 
 According to this hfl source, Carl Johan was born on 26-Mar-1833 in Ekeby parish, which is also in Östergötland.
 
 But - when I go to the church books of Ekeby parish and start looking for him, then it strikes me that I have no clue what his father and mother would be named.
 
 I've tried to look at baptisms of male boys on 26 Mar 1833 in Ekeby parish. Can't say I've found a good match.
 
 Kron was a name that followed the job Carl Johan had - it probably went with the soldier no 70 in Stångebro company, whoever that was at any given time.
 
 How would you recommend progressing ? Both in general - how to find out what a soldier (and his father) was named before becomming a soldier, and in this specific case ?
 
 Smile,
 Stein R

[Sven-Ove Brattström]

Hi Stein,  
in this specific case you can easily follow the family backwards in time. You will then find that Carl Johan and Stina Lisa came from Mjölby (E) in 1859. Mjölby church records states that they lived on the farm Kohlstad Berggård when leaving for Vena (E). Reading Mjölby husförhörslängd AI:18 page 61 shows that his full name, before becoming Kron, was Carl Johan Carlsson. The records states that he came to Mjölby (E) from Ekeby (E) in 1853, AND that he was born in 1836. Using the same method reading the church records for Ekeby (E) parish will take you back to 1836, you will find him at the farm Ugglehult where he was born 1836-03-23. Fathers name was Carl Håkansson, mothers name was Carin Svensdotter.
 
It is advisable to use the above method when possible, as it would lower the risk for mixing a person with another having the same name.
 
When doing research on soldiers, there are a number of sources to go for. I am not an expert in that field, so I will not try to give any advices to you. But I am convinced that you will receive several answers from people who have knowledge of how to do.
 
Regards,    Sven-Ove

[Jan Ek (Janek)]

Finding the patronymic name is sometimes as easy as consulting the Central soldiers register. If he can be found there, his patronymic name is most of the time shown in the index entry. And if not in the index it's of course in the record itself, available on mikrofilm/fiche.
 
This internet resource on soldiers is a work in progress, and an index built on a second hand source; following the method described by Sven-Ove is the recommended way to get it right. This particular person is also a good example of how unreliable one single examination entry can be, if not checked with multiple entries over time following the family's moves.
 
But turning to the military records can also be of great help when the parish records are lost. They have also helped me pointing at a possible family at a time before parish records even started, on one of my very early soldiers. They can also give the time of death sometimes hard to find, and generally fill out the picture. In the 18th century you can expect the soldiers to be engaged in wars during their time of service.

[Stein Rypern]

Jan and Sven-Ove --
 
 Thank you both for the reply. Let me check that I got it right:
 
 
 in this specific case you can easily follow the family backwards in time. You will then find that Carl Johan and Stina Lisa came from Mjölby (E) in 1859.  
 
 
 Follow backwards in this case is what - earlier years of husforh?r for Veta from genline.se ? Or some other source ?  
 
 
Mjölby church records states that they lived on the farm Kohlstad Berggård when leaving for Vena (E).  
 
 
 Assume Vena is just a typo for Veta. But from which specific type of church records (and from what source) did you find the farm they lived on ?  
 
 
Reading Mjölby husförhörslängd AI:18 page 61 shows that his full name, before becoming Kron, was Carl Johan Carlsson. The records states that he came to Mjölby (E) from Ekeby (E) in 1853, AND that he was born in 1836.  
 
 
 So are you saying he became a soldier (and took the name Kron) already around 1853, while living in Mjölby parish ?  
 
 Or have I misunderstood completely when I thought that husforhör only covered those farms where there were soldiers - they cover *all* farms ?
 
 
Using the same method reading the church records for Ekeby (E) parish will take you back to 1836, you will find him at the farm Ugglehult where he was born 1836-03-23. Fathers name was Carl Håkansson, mothers name was Carin Svensdotter.  
 
 
 Thank you for looking this up for me ! So Carl Johan Kron was actually the first Kron (in a descending line) who kept that name.
 
 And in just a few weeks there will be a new Kron baby in Helena, Montana, USA - a great great great grandchild of Carl Johan and Stina Lisa.
 
 Btw - I have updated my list of Kron descendants in America - it can be found at  
 kron descendants
 
Smile,
Stein

[Hans Högman]

Stein, the name of the regiment you are mentioning doesn't sound right. The Göta Life Guards (Göta Livgarde) was an enlisted regiment garrisoned in Stockholm. It was only the allotted regiments that had soldier crofts located in the different provinces. As I understand your query, your soldier was an allotted soldier (indelt soldat) in the province of Östergötland?  
Stångebro Company was a company within the Östergötland Infantry Regiment which from circa 1816 is referred to as First Life Grenadier Regiment (Första Livgrenadjärregementet, I4).
Hans

[Ingela Martenius]

Stein,
 
I don't have access to the records in question, but your questions are pretty general so I'll attempt to answer them anyway.
 
Follow backwards - looking up the same person in previous Hfl:s; in this case, yes Veta leading to Mjölby and Ekeby.
At the same house is the same man in one or several previous Hfl, there is a note when he arrived from some other place (inside or outside the parish) - this corresponds with the note in the Hfl from where he left (whether just another page in the same Hfl or an Hfl in another parish).
 
Mjölby church records - provided they exist the migration records (moving in/out of the parish) are usually a great help when locating the specific place where someone lived before/after moving. If they don't exist, you just have to read through the whole of the pertinent Hfl.
 
Reading Mjölby husförhörslängd - no, that's not what Sven-Ove says: he says that Carl Johan's patronymic was Carlsson and that this is what he used before he eventually became Kron. Carl Johan probably became a soldier upon settling in Veta (or putting it the other way round: he moved to Veta since this was where he could sign up as a soldier). This means that in Veta he is not known under his patronmyic and you have to go back to the Mjölby Hfl to see his patronymic.
Naturally the Hfl:s cover everybody; not just farms but also crofts and dug-outs and vicarages and townhouses - and manor-houses and castles where counts and barons lived. Everybody in Sweden was registered in an Hfl.
 
Many - most - soldiers kept their soldier name after they were discharged but it was only very late in the 19th century that the children would start using this name. This ties in with the abolition of the allotment system coinciding with the use of surnames being regulated.
 
Ingela

[Stein Rypern]

Hi Ingela - okay, I now understand the general system - but still have a bit of trouble applying them in this specific case.
 
 Okay - so the first sighting in this specific case was GID 406.27.55100, ie page 262 (farm no 264 Svås Wäster Sörgård) in the Hfl for 1876 to 1886 for Veta.
 
 Previous hfl for Veta would be the one from 1867-77. The samme farm here would be GID 406.26.36400, right ? I cannot spot Carl Johan here ? Of course, all the crossing out of lines etc doesn't make these records extremely easy to read - but still ?
 
 Previous to that would be Hfl 1857-67, and the same farm would be GID 406.12.21500. Again - I still can't see Carl Johan Kron there.
 
 What am I doing wrong (apart from possibly needing far stronger glasses ;-) ?
 
 Smile,
 Stein

[Elisabeth Thorsell]

Stein, when you are reading the hfl, there can be several pages for the same farm: first the major farm itself, then crofts and cottages and perhaps a soldattorp, soldier's croft. So maybe you are on the right track, but need to look at more pages.

[Stein Rypern]

Hi Hans --  
 
 You are right - I got the name of the regiment mixed up when translating from Swedish to English.
 
 Carl Johan Kron was indeed a Lifgrenadjer in Stångebro company of the First Life Grenadier Regiment, aka Östergötland infantry regiment.
 
 Btw - how come this regiment from 1816 had a life prefix ?
 
 It apparently was a regular infantry unit, not part of some elite group of bodyguards for the sovereign ?  
 
 And Swedish regiments hasn't been in a shooting war since 1814, has they ? So the regiment probably did not earn the life name by extra valor in combat either.  
 
 Does lif mean guards in Swedish, or does it signify something else ?
 
 Just curious.
 
 Smile,
 Stein

[Stein Rypern]

Hi Elisabeth --  
 
 Even worse - I am far off track. The numbers in the upper left corner of the page is not some unique farm identification number, are they ? They are simply page numbers.
 
 So no guarantee that what is on page 264 in the 1867-1877 hfl is the same farm that is on page 264 of the 1876-1886 hfl.
 
 . No wonder I did not find anything in the previous hfl when looking the first time.
 
 So what is the system - alfabetical by farm ? Random route through the farms ? Do I have to check all pages of the hfl to find a given farm ?
 
 Smile,
 Stein

[Stein Rypern]

I finally found Carl Johan Kron in the 1867-1877 Hfl for Veta at GID 406.26.30600.  
 
But I still don't understand how I can tell from that record that it is the same farm as GID 406.27.55100 from the 1876-1886 Hfl ?  
 
 Sorry if I ask way too many naive questions here - not my intention to waste time for anyone else - I am just trying to learn.
 
 Smile,
 Stein

[Janne Svensson]

Stein, I can?t answer your question, but don?t be afraide to ask. It?s a lot of people how wants to give you a hand. It?s same satisfaction to give help as it is to get helpt!

[Elisabeth Thorsell]

Stein, the farms are usually listed in a topographical order, that made sense to the minister as he rode his rounds in the parish and checked the people's knowledge of cathechism, which he then recorded in the hfl, and which is the reason for their existence. Usually the same order is used, sometimes they change to alphabethical in the later 1800s.
 
The numbers in the corners are usually the page numbers. If you are lucky there is an index either at the start of the volume or at the end. If there is no index, you have to go page by page and keep looking for the name of the major farm, and then you will also find the smaller places on the out-lying lands of that farm.
 
The liv in livgrenadjär was an honorary designation given to the two allotment regiments of Östergötland in 1791, when they were joined into the Livgrenadjärregementet. I don't remember exactly why, perhaps because of having done a good job during the 1788-90 war against Russia.

[Kay Engman]

Stein,
 
You need to buy a copy of this guide to Swedish genealogy:
Cradled in Sweden by Carl-Erik Johansson
There is a chapter explaining the military records, a chapter on the clerical survey records (HFL) and a chapter on the parish records.  
 
Go to this page:
http://www.genealogi.se/roots/start.htm
and scroll down to Cradled in Sweden is back!
There is a link there to the publisher in Utah.
 
There is so much information in this book that would take you years to discover on your own.  I bought my first copy in the late 70s and just bought a copy of the new edition last year - I still find it interesting to read.  It is nice that he shows samples of the different Swedish documents as he explains how to 'decipher' them.
 
Good luck!
Kay

[Stein Rypern]

Hi Janne, Elisabeth and Kay --  
 
 Thanks for the replies!  
 
 Janne - I agree with you that asking questions is necessary to learn, but still would like to say thank you to everybody who spends his or her valuable time replying to my questions which might very well be FAQs (Frequently Asked/ Answered Questions).
 
 Elisabeth : so the basic rule for the order of entries in a hfl is whatever made sense to the local vicar ? :-)
 
 Fair enuff. It just means that I cannot be quite as quick to declare that someone is *not* in a particular hfl - I need to check more carefully than I did in my initial attempt of backtracking.  
 
 Guess my basic surprise was that there wasn't a quicker way of locating each farm record. Nobody has made and published help indices where you quickly can find what pages a particular farm name is on ?
 
 This makes me even *more* appreciative of those kind individuals who take the time to help others here look up stuff from such sources - it must take a lot longer to look up something than I would have initially assumed.
 
 Kay - your recommendation for a book is duly noted. Will check it out and compare it with whatever other books are available in English or Swedish. Thank you for the recommendation!  
 
 Smile,
 Stein

[Hans Högman]

Stein, here is some information about the change of names for the regiment.
In 1791 the Östgöta Infantry regiment was merged with the Östgöta Cavalry Regiment and the infantry part of the regiments received the name; the rotehåll division of the Life Grenadier Regiment (Livgrenadjärsregementets rotehållsdivision).  
The cavalry regiment was then a dismounted regiment.
In 1816 the new regiment was divided and reorganized into the two old regiments. The former infantry regiment received the name the First Life Grenadier Regiment (Första Livgrenadjärregementet, I4) and the former cavalry regiment received the name the Second Life Grenadier Regiment (Andra Livgrenadjärregementet, I5).
I'm not familiar with the story behind the “liv” part of these two regiment's names. My guess is that it is just an honorary title. They are not life guard regiments. The life guard regiments have “livgarde” in their names, like Svea Livgarde, Göta Livgarde or Livgardet till häst (Mounted Life Guards).
 
If you are interested in the information you can find in the military records about “your” soldier you should start with the general muster rolls (GMR) of the Första Livgrenadjärregementet. In the US the Swedish GMRs can be obtained from the LDS Family History Centers.
Here is a page about  researching the Swedish military sources
 
The archiving institute for military records in Sweden is  Krigsarkivet (The War Archive).
Hans

[Elisabeth Thorsell]

Stein,
 
there are modern indexes to all the hfls in Östergötland, but they were made after the filming, and are, as far as I now, only available at the Provincial Archives (Landsarkivet) in Vadstena. But some hfls also have contemporary indexes, as I mentioned above.
 
The route the minister rode through the parish is usually the same during the centuries, as it was probably easiest to just follow the known roads.

[Jan Ek (Janek)]

Stein,
 
On the subject of good reading. Part from Kay's good tip, you need to decide which language is easiest for you, Swedish or English. A good book about Swedish research in your native language Norwegian is nonexistent as far as I know. So you're out of luck there  
 
What I think might be a standard textbook in English is the just published Your Swedish Roots, sold by Genline and probably many well-stocked bookstores. In Swedish you will find the same content by the same authors in Släktforska - Steg för steg and with a later follow-up about less used sources outside the parish records, Släktforska vidare. Have a look at the Rötter bookstore here at this site, all are excellent primers on the subject.
 
Stein: Nobody has made and published help indices where you quickly can find what pages a particular farm name is on?
 
Yes, there are, but not for every parish. The main collection is the series of indexes published by SVAR, but there might very well be others made by local genealogists. If you can't find your way by the means of a search engine, a question under the respective parish might trigger a clarifying response.
 
To find your way around SVAR website is not always easy, but for the electronic versions now encompassing six län go:
 
Startsida  >  Forska  >  Söktjänster  >  Statliga arkivregister  >  By- och gårdsdatabas
 
For the printed ones, go
 
Startsida >  Bokhandel  >  Produkter
 
Smaller parishes are usually fast to look through, Elisabeth described the basic routine, but for more populous parishes a published index of all instances of a farm is a blessing. There are many cases where the priests run out of space and continued with the same farm at another page in the book. His job was to record his own work, not to create a system for the future generations  
 
Another trick for locating a smaller place when there is no index in the hfl itself, is to look at another book for another time span that does have one, then find out under what major farm this cottage resides, and with the help of that name and sometimes also the Rote division make faster progress in the volume your main interest lies.
 
Since the Rote is a geographical division many priests seem to use this division also for organizing their own hfl.

[Stein Rypern]

I am extremely grateful (många, många tack!) to all those who have replied to my questions here - I have learned a lot in a short time.
 
 I see that the SVAR website is up again - they had some kind of IIS/MS SQLServer problem earlier today when I first saw Jan's reply and tried it, but now I can access the site again.  
 
 So I'll have a look at what is there index-wise, even though I suspect that Elisabeth is right - it doesn't really matter what system was used as long as it was used fairly consistently for the same parish (socken), and you figure outthe system.
 
 Btw - Elisabeth - your name is well known over here in Norway, too, and I have heard other Norwegians praise a book you have written - it is certainly on my list of things to check out for research in Sweden.  
 
 Jan - yes, it is a problem sometimes to decide whether to look for something in English or Swedish. Swedish and Norwegian are very similar, but just different enough to trip me up sometimes.  
 
Plus - I am doing this research in Sweden for my American brother-in-law, who is of Swedish descent - I need to be able to write up the results in English anyways. So I guess I am a little inclined towards finding how-to books in English - and then just be very glad that I can understand Swedish reasonably well in various sources etc.
 
 Hans - your advice is duly noted (and your *excellent* web site was already bookmarked on the recommendation of Jan Ek in a different thread a while back). I'll see if my sister in law in America can get the muster roll info on Carl Johan Kron - she works across the street from a LDS Family History Center.
 
 Time for me to hunker down and start digging backwards in the family of Carl Johan Kron.
 
 Thank you, everybody !!
 
 Grin,
 Stein

[Stein Rypern]

Btw - I decided to get Your Swedish Roots.  
 
 Not from genline - for some reason they only ship within Sweden, which seems a little weird for an English language book, but as long as amazon.com can deliver, who cares ? :-)
 
 Okay, back to digging. Thanks again!
 
 Grin,
 Stein