Äldre inlägg (arkiv) till 12 maj, 2012

[Barry Hill]

I am trying to search for my G-Grandparents origins in Sweden in the 1860's /1890.  I have both of my G-Grandparents names as well as the given names of their parents.  I am assuming the surnames changed from my G-Grandparents to my 2nd G-Grandparents  
 
Additionally I have both of my G-Grandparents dates of arrival in New York but have not found them on a passenger list in part due to the common names (Johnson and Carlson)
 
My G-Grandmother listed her place of birth as Yatenberg, Slerta, Sweden
I know her parents' names
 
My G-Grandfather received a letter from his brother who was a stone cutter in Lysekil, Sweden in 1919. I also know his parents' names.
Can anyone give me insight on where to start?  Does anyone recognize those place-names in Sweden.  I have the handicap of not knowing any Swedish other than a few words my Great grandmother taught me as a little child, but I am willing to struggle to learn the basics of old vital record headings etc.
 
Thank You so much for any help you can give.

[Moderator English]

I suggest you to post a regular query, either in acctual US state where they ended up or common sub-topic for search for US Emigrants.  
List what you have got (full names, dates of birth, date and port of arrival, places where lived) and sources of your information.  
Also known names of relatives who stayed behind in Sweden are of interest.

[Barry Hill]

Thank you for your reply.  I already have most all the information about them in the states (Pennsylvania)  I am trying to connect to their origins in Sweden.
 
The return address on the letter to my G-Grandfathers(Alfred Wilhelm Carlson DOB June 1862) said Lysekil, Sweden  Is that a known geographical area that still exists?
 
My G-Grandmother Selma Elizabeth Johnson born 27 Oct 1870 listed Yatenberg, Slerta, Sweden as her birth place.  Does that still exist.  A google search suggests finds no such place and suggests it might be Gotenborg not Yatenberg  Also what is Slerta? I can find nothing for that.  I do not know if it is a town or a parish or something else.
 
Sorry for being so ignorant at this stage but I must start some place.

[Gunnar Håkansson]

Lysekil is a well known town on the west coast of Sweden. Yatenberg and Slerta are probably misspellings - I have no idea.

[Mats Ahlgren]

Perhaps this is your G-Grandmother?  
 
Post 642189
 
Adamsson, Selma Elisabeth
Unmarried woman
 
b. 10/27/1870 in Slöta, Skaraborgs län (Västergötland)
 
Emigrated 4/11/1889
from Mossagården, Slöta, Skaraborgs län (Västergötland)
to Amerika
 
Source: SVAR; Household Examination Roll, vol. Slöta AI:11, p. 194
 
Emibas migration file ID: Slöta R 1889 008

[Barry Hill]

My G-G Father: Alfred Wilhelm Carlson was born in June 1862 in Sweden and emigrated to New York on 17 June 1883 or 1885 (difficult to read).  He lists his parents as August and Christine.
 
In Dec 1919 he received a letter. I think it was from a brother.  My best reading of the return address with a magnifying glass is Anton Magnusson Hojden No. 4 Lysekil,  Keep in mind I do not read Swedish but I am trying. Hojden has a mark over the o (how do I type that) and what I call an upper case H may be another letter in Swedish.  But Lysekil is possibly where my G-Grandfather is from. This is all I know.  
 
Can anyone help with advice, clues, anything.  If I do not find this link I fear no one else in my family will.  I live in Pennsylvania and am happy to help others if I can.
 
Thanks so much.  I feel a bond just communicating with people from Sweden.
 
Barry
 
[color=0000ff](Birthdate in line 1 corrected from 1962 to 1862/Moderator)[/color]

[Barry Hill]

Aaaaaaaaaha Mats, Possibly, but I can't resolve the Adamsson instead of Johnson.
 
Also, since I am learning could you be so kind as to explain each of these divisions:
Mossagården, Slöta, Skaraborgs län (Vägsterötland)  
 
I do know that Skaraborgs is a lan but I don't understand the other divisions and (Vägsterötland).  I am not sure if they are listed from smallest to largest (perish, town, LAN) or what the system is.  And was (Vägsterötland) an old name for Skaraborgs?
 
Finally, Can you explain what post 642189 means?
 
Sorry for so many questions.
Thank you.

[Harriet Hogevik]

Hi Barry,
I will try to help you. Is there any more information such as any name of other brothers or sisters?
Regards Harriet
 
(Meddelandet ändrat av hkh 2012-05-12 06:56)

[Moderator USA]

Thread transfered from Discussions in English/General questions as that sub-topic is not supposed for queries for individiuals/families.
Also postings done in other sub-topic transfered here to avoid double-posting and to show full background.
(Heading adjusted by moderator, based on information in the first original postings)

[Mats Ahlgren]

Hi
 
The information is from a CD called Emibas. Information is gathered, manually, from household recordsm so it is a second source and needs to be checked.
 
Mossagården is the farm/village, Slöta is the parish. Sweden do have two different ways of describing county. Län (Skaraborg) is an administrative creation and changes from time to time, Västergötland is n older form, and do not change.
 
Post 642189 is the identification number for the information in the data base.
 
Selma was the daughter of Adam Jonsson and Maja Lena Carlblom, and with the patronymic usage in Sweden youcan see the reason for Adamsson (could have been Adamsdotter, Adam's daughter as well). She could hav eused any of the names when entering US, father's surname Jonsson or Adamsson.

[Moderator USA]

Barry: As a basic help to understand the regional structure of Sweden - now and in old days,
I suggest a visit on this site: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Counties_of_Sweden
From there you can get further into details
 
As to your question above (at 02:11):
Mossagården, Slöta, Skaraborgs län (Västergötland)
Farmname - Parish - County = Län (Province)

[Barry Hill]

Hi Harriet,
I appreciate your offer to help.  I feel like a baby with a million things to learn even about how this forum works although I am very computer literate.
 
Above I meant to type My G-G Father: Alfred Wilhelm Carlson was born in June 1862 not 1962.  The only thing I have is that one short letter from Anton Magnusson I mention above.  I had a lady I met only once who reads Swedish look at it years ago and she had trouble with it (not modern Swedish or such) but said it started Dear Brother and was asking Alfred to send a few dollars for our parents who were 79 and 82 years old 1n Dec 1918. The name Alma is mentioned in the letter and could be a younger sister. It mentions Your parents and siblings but no other names other than Alma and the return address on Anton presumably the writer and brother.  Anton may have been a stone cutter. I wish I had more clues but only that letter.
 
I am so sorry if I am rambling.  I will write what I know and the source and what I suspect and the source.  I could attach a copy of the very old letter if that is allowed, or email you if that is considered best.  I do not want to misuse this forum or your kindness.
 
Verified: Alfred Wilhelm Carlson born June 1862, Sweden - Arrived in New York, NY 17 June 1883 (or 1885)not married at that time. Pennsylvania marriage license states Alfred's parents names are August and Christine.  
 
Based on December 1918 letter from Anton Magnusson (C.A. Magnusson)Höjden No.4, Lysekil, I have reason to think: Alfred had a brother in Lysekil Sweden in 1918 and that he cared for their parents August (82)and Cristine (79). I also suspect that Alma was a younger sister of Alfred born after 1863.
 
Thank you
Barry

[Leif Lundkvist]

Hi Barry,
 
I guess you have already found out that Höjden is Swedish for the hill. If Alfred Wilhelm was really born June 1862 (Moderator: maybe correct the topic name?) it was not in Lysekil or the parishes most nearby. The postal address in Anton Magnusson Höjden No. 4 Lysekil is not easily translated to a clergical address, and I have not found him either, but if they are really brother it suggests that their father was August Magnusson. Do you have any more details about Alfred Wilhelm? I guess he and Selma did not emigrated as a couple, but found each other in US.
 
Greetings
Leif

[Barry Hill]

Hello Leif,
 
Thank you for your reply. I thought that Hödjen was maybe the name of a parish or farm  Thank you for the translation.
You are correct that Alfred and Selma met in the US.
 
Can you explain where the name Carlson could have come from if his Alfred's father would have been August Magnusson?  Also how many parishes would have been in Lysekil.  Could I scan records of all the parishes if I knew all the parish names?
 
How do I get the moderator to correct the topic name to 1862?

[Barry Hill]

I am looking for my roots through My G-Grandmother who died when I was five years old. I recall her Swedish conversation, rough hands and loving hugs.
 
She was Selma Elizabeth Johnson, born 27 Oct 1870.  Her 1940 U.S. alien registration lists her place of birth as Yatenberg Sweden Slerta. It also lists that she arrived in New York, NY 12 April 1889 at age 18 on White Line.  She was not married at that time. (She immigrated alone with no family although a girl friend is said to have come with her). She came straight from New Your to Pennsylvania and worked as a domestic servant.
 
Her Pennsylvania marriage license states her father's name was Adam and her mother's name was Eliza
 
Her 1955 death announcement says she was born in Stockholm Sweden but I think that is probably an error.
 
Any help with clues is appreciated.  I have ready, quick, access to a small Church of Jesus Christ of LDS Family History Center and can view images of perish records online but I read no Swedish and do not know where to start. I can learn to read record headings however.
 
Thank You.

[Olle Kandell]

I'm quite sure that Höjden No 4 is a part of a farm outside the city but might be a postal adress under Lysekil.
Just outside Lysekil is another parish = Lyse. In the parishrecord (Litt Lyse 1915-1930 AII:7 page 703 - AD Online) is found a Höjden No 4 under Träleberg (farm?).  
Interesting are some of the names and their DOB and occupation:
 
Karl August Magnusson b 20 Apr 1837 (smed = blacksmith)
Stina Britta Mattsdotter b 10 Oct 1840 (wife)
son Anton Emanuel Karlsson b 1 Feb 1873 (stenhuggare =stoneworker/-cutter)
This son might as well has used surname Magnusson as his father.
 
I think this is worth to follow back-track.
 
Sinc
Olle K

[Carl Wolf]

Here is the family Olle found from the 1880 census.
 
Karl August Magnusson, b. 1837 in Väne-Ryr Älvsborgs län, Smed
Britta Stina Mathiasdotter, b. 1840 in Brålanda Älvsborgs län
Johan Alfred, b. 1865 in Bäve Göteborgs- och Bohuslän
Alma Ottilia, b. 1870 in Bäve Göteborgs- och Bohuslän
Anton Emanuel, b. 1873 in Bäve Göteborgs- och Bohuslän
Amandus Teodor, b. 1876 in Väne-Ryr Älvsborgs län
 
They also had a son born 26 May 1862 but his name was Johan Anton, so maybe this is not the right family.

[Olle Kandell]

The family moved in to Lyse from Väne-Ryr parish in Dec 18 1889.Verified in Väne-Ryr moving out record (Litt B:1 1889 no 39-44 AD-online).
When checking where they moved from - Kollerö (Litt AI:4 page 182) is another son listed -
Johan Alfred Karlsson b 14 Sep 1865- He emigrated to N Amerika 1885 !.
There is also another sister Alma Ottilia b 29 Apr 70.
 
Even if names and years differs partly - they looks interesting.
 
/Olle

[Olle Elm]

Hi Barry,
Perhaps you would like to see what it looks like in the records of catechetical meetings:

Source: Väne-Ryr AI:3 (1870-1882) Bild 96 / sid 172 from http://www.arkivdigital.net/
 
Kind regards,
Olle Elm

[Barry Hill]

Olle, I cannot contain my excitement.  When I first read your post I was interested but confused then I studied it and this is my take on it. Tell me if it makes sense.
 
You found Karl August Magnusson who was born the same year as the father in Anton's Magnusson's letter to Albert Carlson and he has the name of August which is Albert's father's name per Albert's marriage license. Stina Mattsdotter was born the same year as the Mother in Anton's letter to Albert and and has a name Stina that is likely a form of the name Christina which is Albert's Mother's name per Albert's marriage license. Albert and Anton went by Carlson/Karlsson the father's first name.  In 1918 Anton used Anton Magnusson as a return address (his father's surname). On the one return address on the back of the envelope says C. A. Magnusson (maybe means Carl August )In the letter Anton refers to stone cutting has been down for 4 years and he has little work.  The Anton you found is a stone cutter.  Finally the address is Hojden No. 4
 
This is enough circumstantial evidence to hang a man   If it is not my family then life is playing a serious trick on me.
 
I am a retired police officer and prison official but I could shed a tear of joy and appreciation at what you found.  Thank You
 
What I need is simple clear explanation on how to back track and how to see this record. I think you are telling me that I should find records under the Lyse Parrish.  I am not sure of the record type (Census etc.) From there I would just work back in time in that parish to see if they have other records that would list siblings until I can follow a trail back that puts Albert Wilhelm in the family as a boy.
 
If you have any tips you can spell out please let me know.  Do not think I know them.  If however you have no tips at all, you have already done so much.  I had just abandoned this line in the search for 25 years thinking I could never find it.  But computers have now brought us together.
 
Barry

[Magnus Persson]

I think this is her (from EMIBAS):
 
Post 642189
 
Adamsson, Selma Elisabeth
Ogift kvinna
 
f. 27/10 1870 i Slöta, Skaraborgs län (Västergötland)
 
Utvandrad 11/4 1889
från Mossagården, Slöta, Skaraborgs län (Västergötland)
till Amerika
 
Källa: SVAR; Husförhörslängd, vol. Slöta AI:11, s. 194
 
Emibas emigrationsakt: Slöta R 1889 008

[Judy Olson Baouab]

Emibas CD  (parish records of emigration)
 
Post 642189
 
Adamsson, Selma Elisabeth
Unmarried woman
 
b. 10/27/1870 in Slöta, Skaraborgs län (Västergötland)
 
Emigrated 4/11/1889
from Mossagården, Slöta, Skaraborgs län (Västergötland)
to Amerika
 
Source: SVAR; Household Examination Roll, vol. Slöta AI:11, p. 194
 
Emibas migration file ID: Slöta R 1889 008
 
 
========================
 
Emihamn database (port police records of emigration)
 
 
Efternamn (last name):   ADAMSON
Förnamn (given names):     SELMA E
Ålder (age):       18            Kön (gender): K (female)
Född (born): 1870/1871
Församling (parish ):  SLÖTA    Län (county): R (Skaraborg)
Titel/Anm: (title/remarks)  
Utresehamn (moving out port):  GÖTEBORG
Utvandrdag (moving out day):  1889 05 03 (May 3)
Destination (destination): BEECH CRECK
Medåkande (This indicates whether she was traveling on the same ticket with someone;):   NEJ (no)
Källkod (source code):     38:557:26691 (volume:page:ticket number)
 
====================================
1880 Swedish Census CD:
 
Jonsson, Adam   1833   Father
Carlbom, Maria Lena   1830   Mother
(Barn), Klas Levin   1858   Child
(Barn), Amanda Augusta   1866   Child
(Barn), Selma Elisabeth   1870   Child
(Barn), Hilda Josefina   1874   Child
 
 
Record 1880-16-127-1027
 
Jonsson, Adam
Arbetare
 
b. 1833 in Sandhem (Skaraborgs län, Västergötland)
 
Man, married, father
 
Mossagården
Slöta (Skaraborgs län, Västergötland)
 
Place of birth (in the database): Sandhem Skaraborgs län
 
 
Record 1880-16-127-1028
 
Carlbom, Maria Lena
 
b. 1830 in Valstad (Skaraborgs län, Västergötland)
 
h.
Woman, married, mother
 
Mossagården
Slöta (Skaraborgs län, Västergötland)
 
Place of birth (in the database): Valstad Skaraborgs län
 
 
Record 1880-16-127-1029
 
Klas Levin
 
b. 1858 in Hångsdala (Skaraborgs län, Västergötland)
 
s.
Man, single, child
 
Mossagården
Slöta (Skaraborgs län, Västergötland)
 
Place of birth (in the database): Hångsdala Skaraborgs län
 
 
Record 1880-16-127-1030
 
Amanda Augusta
 
b. 1866 in Slöta (Skaraborgs län, Västergötland)
 
d.
Woman, single, child
 
Mossagården
Slöta (Skaraborgs län, Västergötland)
 
Place of birth (in the database): Slöta Skaraborgs län
 
 
Record 1880-16-127-1031
 
Selma Elisabeth
 
b. 1870 in Slöta (Skaraborgs län, Västergötland)
 
d.
Woman, single, child
 
Mossagården
Slöta (Skaraborgs län, Västergötland)
 
Place of birth (in the database): Slöta Skaraborgs län
 
 
Record 1880-16-127-1032
 
Hilda Josefina
 
b. 1874 in Slöta (Skaraborgs län, Västergötland)
 
d.
Woman, single, child
 
Mossagården
Slöta (Skaraborgs län, Västergötland)
 
Place of birth (in the database): Slöta Skaraborgs län
======================

[Barry Hill]

Olle,  
 
You posted 2 times while I was typing my post so now I see your additional information and know is is clearly them and it is you who have connected us.
 
Bless you.  I have to stop and take it all in.
 
Barry

[Olle Elm]

When I read Yatenberg Sweden Slerta I guess it could be the words:  Göteborg, Sweden, Slöta  
Kind regards,
Olle Elm
 
(Meddelandet ändrat av smol 2012-05-12 18:55)

[Moderator USA]

I have transfered three more postings from a thread that now is closed.
The reason of closing the other thread, is that it generated a double-posting
which is not alowed in forum.  
 
I think the problem is well illustrated by the last two answers - those facts were already available
in this thread delivered by others = unneccessary researchwork ...  
 
(The later postings will be left even if info is already found)

[Barry Hill]

OK, Thanks to all that replied.  Unfortunately I have two lines going in this post.  I guess I mentioned both names in a general question post before I knew, and when I tried to set up a post in the proper place for Johnson, they combined them here which makes it pretty confusing for readers/helpers.  I wish I could split all the Selma Johnson posts and put them under the right section or even delete the Johnson posts and start over but I guess we will do with what we have.  
 
Sorry for the confusion and the appearance of double posting which was not my intent.
Barry

[Barry Hill]

Olle Elm, Olle Kandell, Carl Wolf
 
It is weird.  There are some inconsistencies like the DOB of Alfred but it seems way too many coincidences for it not to be the right family.  I must go back to source Albert's date of birth to be 100% sure it is accurate.  He died early in 1919 (froze to death) and I only ever knew my G-Grandmother.  
 
How could August,(age match) Stina (Christine age match) Alfred (emigration date match), Alma, Anton,(occupation match) and all have an address match and not be the family???  Also 1862 seems just a bit early for Albert's DOB because his wife was born 1870.  Also his confirmed marriage date is 1891. Twenty nine is a bit old for a first marriage back in the late 1800's

[Harriet Hogevik]

Hi Barry,
as I promised this morning I think I can help with the address Höjden, even if you have already got a lot of information during the day when I have been out.
 
Höjden no 4 was a house in the parish Lyse, but in the part of Lyse, Slätten, which about 1930 became a part of the town Lysekil. At the time around 1920 this was a municipalsamhälle. The stonecutting industy had a lot of workers moving in from all over Sweden also the herring industry needed workers, men and women. As it was much closer to the post office in Lysekil than in Lyse (500 m instead of 6000 m) probably the inhabitants of Slätten prefered to use Lysekil as their postal address.
 
According to Sveriges dödbok 1901-2009  
Karlsson, Anton Emmanuel dies 19/4 1950. married man since 16/2 - 22, still living at Höjden in Lysekil
 
In the record for the family at Höjden 1915 -1930, Anton has the name Karlsson added later during the period (another pen and handwriting - indicating that he may have changed from his fathers Magnusson to the patronymikon Karlsson during the period - as he used Magnusson 1919 in the letter)
 
Regards Harriet, born in Lyse
 
(Meddelandet ändrat av hkh 2012-05-12 21:22)
 
(Meddelandet ändrat av hkh 2012-05-12 22:34)

[Carl Wolf]

Hi Barry, the record from 1915-30 that Olle found showed that Karl August Magnusson (born 20 Apr 1837) died 25 Feb 1922 in Lyse Parish and his wife Brita Stina Mattiasdotter (born 10 Oct 1840) died there as well on 19 Feb 1923.  You can request their bouppteckning (estate records) online from the State Archive at http://www.riksarkivet.se/default.aspx?id=17462, you will want the Dödsbodelägarna/första sidan/sidorna visar dödsbodelägare or first page, which usually lists all of the deceased's children. Since your great-grandfather died in 1919 it might indicate they had a son in America who was deceased and list his heirs, thereby giving you some confirmation despite the change in name.  The State Archive webpage is in Swedish but you can open a page in Google and under More select Translate to copy/paste in and get (sometimes rough) translations of the Swedish words.  Fields with an * (asterisk) must be filled in, also there is a statement you must accept at the beginning about fees for research, sometimes though if the individual is listed in their index they will e-mail an image of the first page to you without any charge.

[Olle Kandell]

Ref to the Johan Alfred Karlsson mentioned in my posting 12 maj 2012 - 17:32.
He was registered as moving out from Väne-Ryr parish, but in fact he is registered in moving out record of Vassända-Naglum parish on 15 May 1885 !  
(Litt B:2 1885 no 30 AD Online). (This might seem strange, but as I remember from an earlier case, there was a lot of changes
which parish kept the records of that area for those decades.)
 
Anyway - I finally found his departure from Sweden. In EMIHAMN he is registered by name  
Johan Alfred Carlson from Södra Ryr parish (= yet another name for Väne-Ryr ...).
The register code is 26:523:A993. From this he is found in a passengerlist for S/S Orlando
with dep. from Gothenburg on 29 May 1885 for Hull. Final dest is New York. (Searched in Ancestry).
 
But I have so far not been able to find any arrival in NY of him - not even to identify any
ship from England arriving on date 17 Jun ...
 
So Barry: how is the arrival date you have mentioned verified ?
 
And still - this is a speculation if he is the right person ...  
 
/Olle