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Författare Ämne: Need help with 1718 and 1719 tax records for Sickinge, Ljungby parish  (läst 1520 gånger)

2021-01-06, 19:30
läst 1520 gånger

Utloggad Victoria Cihla

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Attached are two tax records I need your help with. 

The first is for 1718 in Sickinge, Ljungby.  I cannot tell what the circled note says.

Mantalslängder 1642-1820 Kronobergs län 1642-1820 (G) 52 (1718) Image: 1490 Page: 1107
https://app.arkivdigital.se/volume/v840176?image=1490&page=1105

The second is for 1719 in sickinge, Ljungby.  I think the same note is repeated at the top of the tax item.  I also need help interpreting  the record itself.  It appears that all the people are listed together as one family, is that correct?  If so, there are 4 adults - would that be Jöns and wife and Märta(?) and ?.  The 3 being Dr Anders and pig and a Dr J? Jönsson?  It is very confusing.  Who are the 4 and who are the 3?

Riksgäldsarkiven-Riksens-ständers-kontor-Kammarkontoret-GIg-808-1719-1720-Image-2390-Page-469
https://app.arkivdigital.se/volume/v835372?image=2390&page=467

Your help would be very much appreciated!

Thanks so much,

Vicki

2021-01-06, 21:17
Svar #1

Utloggad Ulf Svensson

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Nembdeman = Nämndeman. Juryman is what Google translate gives. I would say Layman judge at, in this case, the local court, häradsrätt.

As I understand it you have in the record:
Nämbdeman Jöns,
Dräng Anders,
Pigan Märta,
Dräng Sven Jonsson
After this my understanding ends... :o

2021-01-06, 21:54
Svar #2

Utloggad Victoria Cihla

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Thank you!  I appreciate your help with this. 

It is interesting.  There are a 4 and a 3 listed - so I am assuming this is for 4 people (adults?) and 3 others.  Who are the 4?  Can you tell from this if one of the 4 is the wife of Jöns?  If so, who might the other 2 be?  Or am I reading it incorrectly?

Thanks again for your help!

Vicki

2021-01-06, 22:05
Svar #3

Utloggad Ulf Svensson

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I don't see any wife, only Jöns, two 'drängar' and a 'piga'. Maybe the wife is overaged or sick, and one of the three?
Have you checked the heading text on the first page of the book? I'm only using Riksarkivet and the book isn't digitalized there so I can't see.

2021-01-06, 22:27
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Utloggad Victoria Cihla

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Thanks for your response.  I didn't try for the headings this time as I have had almost no success with it.  They are not consistent between years or parishes so it has become far too cumbersome even though it would be helpful.  So I guess I must be misinterpreting what those counts mean - now it appears it probably 4 total, with 3 of them being two 'drängar' and a 'piga'.   Usually I can reason it out, but not this one.  :)

Thanks again for your help. I always appreciate it!

Vicki


2021-01-07, 21:34
Svar #5

Utloggad Victoria Cihla

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Can you tell me what these headings say?  The "4" and "3" appear in the last 2 columns. This should clear things up, hopefully.

Riksgäldsarkiven Riksens ständers kontor Kammarkontoret GIg:808 (1719-1720) Image: 2390 Page: 469
https://app.arkivdigital.se/volume/v835372?image=2390&page=467

Thanks again for your help!

Vicki


2021-01-08, 07:19
Svar #6

Utloggad Ulf Svensson

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In yor case:


4 mans pers, male persons, and 3 qvins pers, females.

2021-01-08, 13:21
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Utloggad Victoria Cihla

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Thanks very much for this! 

But, this is confusing - I only see four people listed in total.  Am I missing something here? 

Again, thank you for your help,

Vicki

2021-01-08, 14:08
Svar #8

Utloggad Ulf Svensson

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I guess, as usual, the wives aren't mentioned with names in the record. And maybe parents of Jöns? That will give 1 man and 2 women.



2021-01-08, 14:14
Svar #9

Utloggad Victoria Cihla

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Thank you for this information!  I wondered if it included Jöns wife in particular.  Now I believe it does.

It is really challenging to interpret some of these records so your help is really appreciated.

Thanks again,

Vicki

2021-01-08, 15:48
Svar #10

Utloggad Jörgen Tollesson

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We can not take for granted that the numbers are correct and the names are wrong. It can just as well be the other way round.

It's correct that the wife is normally not mentioned by name in the tax records, but the record must show if there is a wife or not. In the other households there is a "h." or "hust.", but not here.

And in the other households on the page the numbers in the columns match the number of persons mentioned - at least in most cases...  :)

So we simply don't know if Jöns have a wife that is paying, but by mistake not mentioned, or if the taxman had problems with his counting...  :)
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2021-01-08, 16:46
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Utloggad Victoria Cihla

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Yes, it is true what you say.

The reason I am trying to establish the marital status of Jöns in 1719 is because his wife is listed on the 1718 tax record and on the next available tax record in 1723 Jöns is not listed but there is a widow Margreta.  I don't know if this was his wife or not but would be something further to pursue in my research.

1718
Mantalslängder-1642-1820-Kronobergs-län-1642-1820-G-52-1718-Image-1490-Page-1107
https://app.arkivdigital.se/volume/v840176?image=1490&page=1105

1723
Riksgäldsarkiven Riksens ständers kontor Kammarkontoret GIg:810 (1722-1723) Image: 1530 Page: 297
https://app.arkivdigital.se/volume/v835374?image=1530&page=295

Also, I have found inconsistencies with the name of the widow.

On the 1724 tax record the widow is called Märtha, who I originally thought might have been a different person altogether, but in subsequent years (from 1725-1729 which is the last record on which her name appears), she was again listed as Margreta, therefore I think it is all the same person.

1724
Riksgäldsarkiven-Riksens-ständers-kontor-Kammarkontoret-GIg-811-1724-Image-2090-Page-411
https://app.arkivdigital.se/volume/v835375?image=2090&page=411

1725
Riksgäldsarkiven-Riksens-ständers-kontor-Kammarkontoret-GIg-812-1725-Image-1950-Page-381
https://app.arkivdigital.se/volume/v835376?image=1950&page=381

1729
Riksgäldsarkiven-Riksens-ständers-kontor-Kammarkontoret-GIg-816-1729-Image-1810-Page-355
https://app.arkivdigital.se/volume/v835380?image=1810&page=355

At this point, I'm only able to document what I find in the tax records as there are no available birth/death/marriage or estate inventories available that early.  It will hopefully be helpful information later at some point.  :)

Thanks so much for your help,

Vicki

2021-01-08, 23:03
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Utloggad Jörgen Tollesson

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There is another tax record called jordebok, that shows the land-tax. You only find the farmer here, no other family members, since it's not a personal tax.

1720 Sickinge has 3 farmers: Jöns, Pehr and Erich.

1721 Jöns is gone, and instead there is the widow Margareta. So it looks like Jöns has died in 1720 or in the beginning of 1721, and that Margareta is his wife.

You can not find these records at Arkiv Digital yet, only at Riksarkivet:

Sickinge 1720

Sickinge 1721

Other years: Jordeböcker, Kronobergs län

(Green button "Bild" = you can read it online. Blue button "Läsesal" = you can only read in the archives, not online.)
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2021-01-09, 00:37
Svar #13

Utloggad Victoria Cihla

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Thank you very much for this information!  Another reason I thought (and hoped) that Margareta might be the widow of Jöns is because one of his granddaughters is named Margareta.  She is the daughter of Jöns son who is also named Jöns. 

I'll take a look at all the helpful information you sent. 

Thank you so much!

Vicki

2021-01-20, 17:00
Svar #14

Utloggad Victoria Cihla

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Hi again Jörgen,

Just want to say thanks again for this information - I've used it to look up other land records also!

I really appreciate the link you sent and your instructions!

Vicki

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