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Författare Ämne: Help with 1718 tax record in Kånna, Kronoberg  (läst 415 gånger)

2020-07-01, 21:39
läst 415 gånger

Utloggad Victoria Cihla

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I'm trying to locate an Erik Persson living in Kånna around 1715/1716. He was born about 1698, so I think he might still be listed with his parents.

Attached is a record of an Erik on the 1715 tax roll, but I cannot tell the father's name for certain, how Erik is related to him or what the comments are to the right of the entries - or if this could even be Erik's family at all.

Can anyone help me with these questions?  The entry is about halfway down on the right hand page at:

https://sok.riksarkivet.se/bildvisning/A0001525_00173#?c=&m=&s=&cv=172&xywh=1490%2C463%2C3666%2C1674

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks very much,

Vicki Cihla

2020-07-01, 21:53
Svar #1

Utloggad Kalle Birgersson

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On the farm is Per and hust., wife. On the line below Enck.(widow) Ingjerd. The note on the right hand side says "aldeles utfattig", totally poor

2020-07-01, 22:19
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Utloggad Victoria Cihla

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Thank you for clearing that up!   :)  I thought Erik might be found at Dragaryd.  His father would have been Per so I also thought that fit, but there are a lot of Pers!  There's a big gap in the tax records for Kånna (between 1718 and 1746) which were the years that the Erik Törnqvist was the soldier. 

Yesterday I spent my time following Erik's children to see if I could find a connection between Erik Persson and Erik Törnqvist but nothing so far.

Any suggestions where else I could look?  I've looked back at the tax records to 1700 and it looks like Per is still there at Dragaryd but, of course, I really even know if that is Erik's father.

I can continue following Erik's children, but it doesn't appear that there is any tie back to the name Törnqvist, at least, so far. 

I have a nagging question about this though.  Do you think that the name Törnqvist would have been used on his wife's death record in 1757 - well, after he left military service in 1739? 

Thanks for your help,

Vicki Cihla

2020-07-01, 23:09
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Utloggad Kalle Birgersson

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Well, there are no tax records between 1718 and 1746, but there is another series of books called "Riksgäldsarkiven Riksens ständers kontor Kammarkontoret". They are similar to the tax records, and they cover most of the gap. Unfortunately they are not available at riksarkivet, you need Arkiv Digital to see them. However, I checked Drageryd Arvidsgården most of the years, and there were no Erik at all. Only Per, eventually leaving the farm to his other son Jöns. And someone else called Måns Nilsson started as a farmhand but also got his own part of the farm after some years.

2020-07-01, 23:26
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Utloggad Victoria Cihla

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Thank you very much for checking that.  I have ArkivDigital for just less than 1 more month so I can look.  Riksarkivet has been so much easier for me to use and assumed they had the same information.

Are these different books altogether where I can check all of Kånna?  In 1746 I found Erik Persson at Kånna Arvidsgarden but apparently the soldier came from Dragaryd Backagård.  I'm a bit confused here about the two Arvidsgardens (Kånna and Dragaryd).  So  I'm trying to figure where Erik lived before he was at Kånna Arvidsgarden. 

This is the oldest entry I have for him:

https://sok.riksarkivet.se/bildvisning/A0001528_00251#?c=&m=&s=&cv=250&xywh=1644%2C440%2C2904%2C1709

He and his wife are listed on the right page about half way down the page.

There seem to be a lot of coincidences regarding his age and the naming of his children so I still wonder if they are the same people. 

Any further thoughts?

Thanks for your help,

Vicki Cihla

2020-07-01, 23:48
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Utloggad Kalle Birgersson

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If you chose "index search" up in left corner in AD, and then "quick find: Mantals tax records" almost at the bottom of the menu, you will get a search form where you can fill in years and Kånna and you will find the books I'm talking about. Here they are called "Längd över lön- och betalningsavgiften"

2020-07-02, 00:26
Svar #6

Utloggad Victoria Cihla

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Thank you!  I found them!  I'll go through them also, to see if I can find Erik again.  :)

I really appreciate this and may have more questions later.

Thanks again,

Vicki Cihla

2020-07-02, 01:21
Svar #7

Utloggad Victoria Cihla

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question -  I found Erik Persson on the 1744 tax records under Kånna Arvidsgarden.  Up a few lines from that there is a listing for Soldattorp - which I think shows it is vacant.  This is after Erik is no longer in the military since he left in 1739.  Should I be able to find Soldattorp on every listing for Kånna socken?  Is this where the soldier should be listed?  Going back through the earlier records is very difficult as the format seems different - the place names are difficult to read - they don't stand out like on later records and the handwriting is a bit trickier. 

https://app.arkivdigital.se/volume/v400709?image=5290&page=1133

I want to understand how best to search for him.   :)   

Thanks for your help,

Vicki Cihla

2020-07-02, 08:52
Svar #8

Utloggad Kalle Birgersson

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Well, it differs from year to year. In some tax records the soldier is written under the farm, but only with the note "soldat", "knecht", "ryttare" or something else. In other tax records all the soldiers are gathered in the end of the record for that parish. Sometimes, if the soldier wasn't married, he is missing from the tax record because soldiers did not have to pay taxes.

2020-07-02, 14:38
Svar #9

Utloggad Victoria Cihla

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Thank you! That's interesting.  I'll watch for those words you've identified.  The letter E is easy for me to recognize, but I am getting Erik confused with the abbreviation for widow!   :)

I found (I think) 2 Erik's listed on the 1740 tax register - will you confirm if I'm reading the names correctly.  This tax register would be taxing for 1739, correct?  This would have been the year he left military service.  Is the place name for the 2nd Erik Arvidsgarden? (it's hard to read).

His children, that I know of, were born during the early to mid 1730's through about 1740, so he should be listed with a wife by 1740 so neither probably fits. 

https://app.arkivdigital.se/volume/v835391?image=1550&page=301

If you think I'm wasting my time on this pursuit, please let me know!  Otherwise, I will continue to try to solve this mystery if you don't mind all the constant (probably idiotic, at times) questions!  I don't mind the effort, as it is all very interesting.

Thanks for your help and all help I have had,

Vicki Cihla

2020-07-02, 15:43
Svar #10

Utloggad Kalle Birgersson

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Those are both Erick, no Enck or any variation of that. To bad there is no last names, but some years there are. If you're lucky you can folow them both until there is a last name or some other way to distinguish them.

And I don't think you are wasting your time, tax records are the way to go in the 1600s and 1700s. It's like a jigsaw puzzle or a sudoku, you need to gather pieces until you have enough to see the whole picture.

2020-07-02, 15:53
Svar #11

Utloggad Victoria Cihla

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Alright, thanks for that!  I will continue reviewing all the tax records and see what I can find!  And, let you know if I have more questions.

Thanks again,

Vicki Cihla

2020-07-02, 21:33
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Utloggad Victoria Cihla

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I just found this tax entry for an Erik on the 1736 tax register for Kånna.  it looks like it has the word "ryttare" after it.  Am I correct?  Is this the soldier Erik?  Is the place Arvidsgarden? - it is hard for me to read...

Thanks for your help!

Vicki Cihla

2020-07-02, 21:34
Svar #13

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2020-07-02, 21:36
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2020-07-02, 21:37
Svar #15

Utloggad Kalle Birgersson

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You are right, "Arfwe" which is an old way to spell Arvid, and G., short for gamle, old or in this case former, ryttare.

2020-07-02, 21:43
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Utloggad Victoria Cihla

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Wonderful!  So now I know which is the correct Erik! 

Hopefully his last name will appear at some point as I go through the records.

This is great!  Thanks so much for your help!

Vicki Cihla

2020-07-02, 22:05
Svar #17

Utloggad Victoria Cihla

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One clarification about the 1735 tax entry -  I had thought that Erik was released from the military in 1739 for poor health.  Is this record saying that he is already the "former" soldier and that he is living at Kånna Arvidsgarden in Kånna parish?   Want to make sure I fully understand what it is telling me. 

Thanks very much,

Vicki Cihla

2020-07-02, 22:12
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Utloggad Kalle Birgersson

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Maybe that G is for gården - Arvidsgården

2020-07-02, 22:25
Svar #19

Utloggad Victoria Cihla

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Thanks!  (I meant the 1736 tax record)

So that means that he is still a soldier, which would make sense.  But could it be that he stayed on at Kånna Arvidsgarden when he was no longer a soldier?  I'm asking because Erik Persson lived there for up until 1764/65, all the way up until his son-in-law married Erik's daughter Elin and subsequently took over the farm.

Can we tell if he was married yet? 

Thanks again for all the help,

Vicki Cihla



2020-07-02, 22:50
Svar #20

Utloggad Kalle Birgersson

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Well, he is paying taxes for one person and normally soldiers didn't have to pay so it should be for a wife. Can't be too sure though, conditions might vary over time.

And it was pretty common for soldiers to stay at the farm efter military service. Sometimes they married a daughter in the family, somtimes they could rent a part of the farm.

2020-07-02, 23:16
Svar #21

Utloggad Victoria Cihla

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Thanks for this information, I had been under the impression that they had to leave.  But, I'm sure that not everything done the same way everywhere and over time, as you say.

I'm still looking at records to see where it leads.  :)

Thanks again,

Vicki Cihla

2020-07-02, 23:47
Svar #22

Utloggad Kalle Birgersson

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They had to leave, if they couldn't come to an agreement with the people at the farm. Many soldier had a hard life after military service, just like today. They often ended up in a shack somewhere, just barely scraping by. And others had some family they could go back to, maybe their parents was old by then and wanted to hand over the farm. At least the soldiers was volunteers in the 1700s, in much of the 1600' they wasn't.

2020-07-02, 23:56
Svar #23

Utloggad Victoria Cihla

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Thank you.  That's interesting.

So far, I've only seen Erik listed as a soldier at Kånna Arvidsgarden twice.  As I've been going back further, It looks like there was a Simon who lived at Arvidsgarden for many years.  I don't see Erik listed but others soldiers are mentioned on other various farms in Kånna.  Not sure what to make of that.   I still see another Erik often listed, but never as a soldier so I think that the Arvidsgarden one is the correct one.  I've never seen his military name listed at all or his patronymic name.  I've gone through all the records back to 1723 so far.  I think I'm getting bleary eyed so will have stop for now.   :) 

Thanks again for your ongoing help,

Vicki Cihla

2020-07-04, 01:00
Svar #24

Utloggad Victoria Cihla

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Attached is a copy of 1722 tax register listing the soldier Törnqvist, but I don't understand it exactly.  This was during the time Erik Törnqvist was the soldier but I don't see Erik mentioned and I'm not sure where the solder whas living. 

Can you tell me what I've found here? 

https://app.arkivdigital.se/volume/v835374?image=1540&page=297

Thanks for your help,

Vicki Cihla

2020-07-04, 06:04
Svar #25

Utloggad Kalle Birgersson

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The place is Dragaryd Backagården and Erik Törnqvist is only paying taxes for his wife.

2020-07-04, 15:14
Svar #26

Utloggad Victoria Cihla

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Thank you!  This is the first time I've seen him listed at Dragaryd Backagården.  I was surprised that he was already married.  Maybe he was married twice.  Not sure about that.

Yesterday I searched the names of the soldiers before and after him (#52) at Dragaryd Backagården.  Only two used the name Törnqvist.  I also finished going through all the tax records.  I have so many questions, and as I learn more I go back through them again.

So  :)  would you prefer a lot of questions at one time or would you prefer I send them one at a time?

This is really interesting and I hope to fully understand the information that is available.  More than ever I realize that not everything is done exactly the same way over time. All of the help I receive from you and others is very important and very much appreciated.

Thanks again for ongoing help,

Vicki Cihla

2020-07-04, 15:25
Svar #27

Utloggad Kalle Birgersson

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Just post the questions when you think of them and I and others will do our best to answer  :)

2020-07-04, 15:31
Svar #28

Utloggad Victoria Cihla

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Sounds good! 

Thanks very much,

Vicki Cihla

 

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