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Författare Ämne: Translation help  (läst 5606 gånger)

2020-01-02, 03:54
läst 5606 gånger

Utloggad Thomas Neil

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I am not sure what some of these words are so please help. Thank you in advance.

ArkivDigital
Kvistofta (M) CI:1 (1689-1795) Image 1920 / Page 186 (AID: v107365a.b1920.s186, NAD: SE/LLA/13223)
http://www.arkivdigital.se/aid/show/v107365a.b1920.s186

2020-01-02, 11:00
Svar #1

Utloggad Per Eriksson

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Not easy to translate that old Swedish into modern English.
But something like this:
The 4th of June wed the boy Nils Nilsson in Quist-
tofta and Bengta Pärsdotter thereon [?] and
at same place out in Quisttofta.


Hope that explains
/Peppe


2020-01-02, 13:57
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Utloggad Kalle Birgersson

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Good translation but I'm not so sure about the name of the bride. The first name looks more like Doreta and the last maybe Sörensdotter?

2020-01-02, 15:18
Svar #3

Utloggad Anti Poika

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och Doreta Sörens dotter där sama-städes (där, på samma plats)

It is the Doreta/Dorothea we have encountered in your last two texts.
Mvh Anti

2020-01-02, 17:47
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Utloggad Kristina Gunnarsdotter

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My suggestion:
The 4th of June was married farm hand Nils Nilsson in Quis-
tofta and Doreta Sörensdotter at the same
place. They live in Quisttofta.
Doreta=Dorotea

2020-01-02, 17:53
Svar #5

Utloggad Anti Poika

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Quistofta/Qwistofta = Kvistofta today
Mvh Anti

2020-01-20, 05:11
Svar #6

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Hello,

I am new here and I have a translation request. I was hoping someone might be so kind as to translate the headers of the columns and the enclosed information about Johanna Maria Ronnlund on the attached image file.

Thank you,

Don Kaiser

2020-01-20, 13:25
Svar #7

Utloggad Anti Poika

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Hello Don and welcome!

The columns in Swedish are

Inskrivningens löpande årsnummer
De framfödda barnens
födelse-år och månad, dag, kön
De levande födda barnens dopnamn,
civilstånd, äkta, oäkta, man, kvinna
Dödfödda, äkta, oäkta
Föräldrarnas namn, ämbete, yrke, stånd, hemvist, nationalitet och religionsbekännelse (om främmande) samt stället för moderns nedkomst (om ej i hemorten)
Barnet adligt
Modern gift, änka eller frånskild, trolovad, ej gift, sist ifyllt åldersår
Förlossnongsbiträdet examinerat
För anteckning av vad särskilt är föreskrivet

A direct translation at Google Translate is (No guarantee that it is a completely accurate translation)

The current year's registration number
The born children
year of birth and month, day, sex
The baptismal names of the living born children,
marital status, genuine, illegitimate, man, woman
Stillborn, genuine, illegitimate
Parents' name, office, profession, family, place of residence, nationality and confession of religion (if foreign) and the place of mother's descent (if not in their place of residence)
The child nobly
Modern married, widowed or divorced, betrothed, unmarried, last entered age
The birth attendant examined
For note of what is specifically prescribed
Mvh Anti

2020-01-20, 13:34
Svar #8

Utloggad Anti Poika

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Johanna Maria, date-of-birth 20 Octobre, oäkta/illegitimate
Parent(s): The maid Hilda Gustafva Rönnlund in Bergsbyn

Utdrag ur 1866 års födelsebok för Skellefteå församling i Västerbotten andra prosteri, Härnösands stift, Västerbottens län
Mvh Anti

2020-01-20, 15:57
Svar #9

Utloggad Kristina Gunnarsdotter

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This is how the original record looks, in the damaged book. Here you see the witnesses at the christening.
Skellefteå landsförsamling (AC) C:12 (1860-1870) Bild 111 / sid 289 (AID: v139644.b111.s289, NAD: SE/HLA/1010174)

2020-01-21, 00:20
Svar #10

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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I'm overwhelmed by the responses to my naive question and I very much appreciate the details you experts provided.

Now I know that Johanna Maria Rönnlund was born 20 Oct 1866 in Bergsbyn as an illegitimate child of the 18-year-old maid Hilda Gustava Rönnlund as recorded in an excerpt from the 1866 birth book for the Skellefteå parish in Västerbotten's second proxy, Härnösand diocese, Västerbotten County. This is fantastic!

I assume that Kristina Gunnarsdotter's post is an excerpt from a different record book - a christening book - whereas my original record is from the birth book. Ms. Gunnarsdotter says the witnesses are listed. Can someone please translate the christening record? Is the date and location of the christening known?

For the record, the maid Hilda Gustava Rönnlund eventually married my great grandfather Sven Jonasson Svensson Björklund from Björkenas before coming to America in 1893. (I think?)

Does anyone know what happened to Johanna Maria Rönnlund?  She was not on the boat with the rest of the family.

2020-01-21, 00:39
Svar #11

Utloggad Anti Poika

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Your first picture shows a transcript or extract of the original record.

The last picture is from the damaged christening book, which is considered to be the original birth record, where the dates of birth and christening is missing. Hilda Gustafva was 18 years old.

The witnesses were:
Torp(aren)(crofter) Joh(an/annes?) Forssman o Hu(stru) (wife) å (at) Kyrkobordet
Stud(ent) Ludv(ig) Walter(?) o pig(a) (maid) Gustafva Hed-
man i Staden (in the town)
Mvh Anti

2020-01-21, 01:15
Svar #12

Utloggad Kristina Gunnarsdotter

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My picture shows the original birth- and christening book and the witnesses were correctly read by Anti. Your picture is an extract sent for statistic reasons to the state. Good to have when the original is damaged or missing. The information about the church archives says that there was a fire October 9 1901 when all volumes were more or less damaged.

Here is a later picture from the household book in Umeå 1888-1893 where you can see that Johanna Maria left for USA already 4 of July 1888. The picture (detail of the left page) is from Arkiv Digital, the link from Riksarkivet. Same picture but different photos.
https://sok.riksarkivet.se/bildvisning/C0034468_00102
Umeå stadsförsamling (AC) AI:15b (1888-1893) Bild 136 / sid 126 (AID: v139946.b136.s126, NAD: SE/HLA/1010220)

2020-01-21, 02:54
Svar #13

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Dear Anti Poika and Kristina Gunnarsdotter,

Thank you so much for sharing your records, details, and translations.  Umeå, Burträsk, Skellefteå, Björkenäs

Is there anyway to determine who the father was?  I know that in Germany, the Catholic church sometimes held special meetings to determine the fathers of illegitimate children. Interesting about the fire in Skellefteå.  I think it was a fire in Umeå that may have prompted my family to migrate?

The link to the page from the 1888-1893 household book is amazing.  So much info. My grandfather was the baby of the family Sven Gunnar Björklund born in 1888. He always denied being born in Sweden. Unfortunately, I won't be able to show him this record, but I suppose he probably knew that he was really born in Umeå.

I hate to ask but there are notes on the page I cannot read. It looks like Maria Johanna went to "Arnas" not America? And I would like to understand Line 23?

Thank you,

Don Kaiser

2020-01-21, 03:21
Svar #14

Utloggad Anti Poika

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We are happy you have found so much information.  :)

Line 5 tells about a move to North America in 1888.

Line 23: Dräng/Farmhand Jonas Eugen Sjöström, inskr./enrolled in military service..., born 8. of Aug. 1869 in Lycksele in Västerbotten, Came from Vännäs in Västerbotten the 12 of November 1891, Attest No 196, f (knowledge in reading), f (knowledge of Christianity), attended clerical survey in 1891 and 1892, Flyttat till/Moved to N.B. 3/922 /Page 922 in the New Book (1894-1998).
Mvh Anti

2020-01-21, 06:58
Svar #15

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Dear Anti Poika,

Thank you for the translation. I'm very glad that I stumbled upon and joined your group.

Best regards,

Don Kaiser

2020-01-22, 22:37
Svar #16

Utloggad Kristina Gunnarsdotter

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The big fire in Umeå was in 1888, June 25, when most of the wooden town with it's narrow streets was destroyed. Maria Johanna emigrated a few days later. After the reconstruction there were broader streets and avenues with a lot of birches to prevent fires to spread. That's why Umeå is called "City of birches".
https://sv.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stadsbranden_i_Ume%C3%A5

The guy Sjöström on line 23 (page 126 in AI:15b) has probably nothing to do with your family. He just lived in the same place. But on line 17 there is a Miss Lovisa Karolina Rönnlund.


2020-01-23, 03:50
Svar #17

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Dear Kristina Gunnarsdotter,

Thank you for your comments and the link about the Umeå fire of 25 Jun 1888. It's amazing to see how devastating the fire was from the photographs on Wikipedia. Yes, it's very interesting now, to know that Maria Johanna emigrated right after the fire.  Sven Jonasson Björkland, my great grandfather, emigrated about 5 years later on 3 May 1893, so perhaps the family lore linking emigration with the fire, is not that obvious. In fact, my grandfather, Sven Gunnar Björkland, was not even alive at the time of the fire and was nearly 5-years-old at the time he, his siblings, his mother, Hilda Gustava Rönnlund (my great grandmother), and Lovisa Karolina, my great great grandmother emigrated on 26 Jun 1893. I'm glad you mentioned Lovisa because I know very little about her and the other supposed family members listed below her on the household page. A translation of those lines would be a good start?

Best regards,

Don Kaiser

2020-01-23, 04:47
Svar #18

Utloggad Anti Poika

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Dear Don,

The Björklund family, for your reading practice. ;)

Skellefteå landsförsamling AI:12j (1871-1880), bild 81, sida 328
Umeå stadsförsamling AI:14a (1877-1887), bild 186, sida 221
Umeå stadsförsamling AI:14b (1877-1887), bild 174, sida 518
Umeå stadsförsamling AI:15b (1888-1893), bild 102, sida 126, as mentioned

Best regards,
Mvh Anti

2020-01-23, 07:55
Svar #19

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Dear Anti Poika,

Fantastic!  Thank you! Great stuff!

The first file seems to show Johanna Karolina Rönnlund?, possibly Hilda's sister?, married to Herman Gustav Lagenholm from Stockholm.  I think it might say that he was a baker?  This is interesting because it might suggest how/why my great grandfather Sven Jonasson Bkörklund (born in Hallaryd) became a baker? I see a place called Byske, which is even further north than Skellefteå, so a baker seems like a good job. It looks like the Bkörklunds moved to Umeå on 4 Oct 1880. It seems Johan Emil was  "oakte." I guess he was illegitimate? Lots of other people on that page.

I'll have to comment on the other files separately.

Thank you so much,

Don Kaiser

2020-01-23, 17:59
Svar #20

Utloggad Anti Poika

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Lovisa Carolina Rönnlund born 25/9 or 25/8 1817.
Parents: Rustmästare Carl Ephraim Rönlund and Anna Maglena Jonsdotter.

Skellefteå landsförsamling C:7b (1811-1817), bild 153, sida 449
Skellefteå landsförsamling AI:5d (1810-1818), bild 157, sida 137
Skellefteå landsförsamling AI:6d (1818-1826), bild 161, sida 435
Skellefteå landsförsamling AI:7f (1826-1836), bild 75, sida 282
Skellefteå landsförsamling AI:8f (1836-1843), bild 247, sida 468
Skellefteå landsförsamling AI:9j (1843-1852), bild 34, sida 22
Skellefteå landsförsamling AI:10h (1853-1863), bild 167, sida 354
Skellefteå landsförsamling AI:11h (1862-1870), bild 120, sida 342
Skellefteå landsförsamling AI:12g (1871-1880), bild 160, sida 351
Skellefteå landsförsamling AI:12j (1871-1880), bild 48, sida 295
Skellefteå landsförsamling AI:12j (1871-1880), bild 81, sida 328
Mvh Anti

2020-01-24, 09:07
Svar #21

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Dear Anti Poika,

Thank you! I'm speechless!  It looks like I will have a whole lot of work to do. So many files. So many new people. So much information. So much Swedish.  It also looks like Umeå wasn't the only place to have a fire. I hope they weren't started by any of my baker relatives. Do you know what bakeries make but don't sell?  See below.

Best regards,

Don Kaiser










Aromas. :)


2020-01-25, 21:42
Svar #22

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Hello,

Can one of you please translate the first word in the attached file?

Thank you,

Don Kaiser

2020-01-25, 21:57
Svar #23

Utloggad Kalle Birgersson

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Mamsell (lady) I believe, but hard to tell from that tiny text. It would be easier if you told us where you found it so we can view it in original and enlarge it.

2020-01-26, 00:57
Svar #24

Utloggad Kristina Gunnarsdotter

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It is Mamsell, in English Miss. It is short for Mademoiselle.

2020-01-26, 07:30
Svar #25

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Dear Kalle Birgersson and Kristina Gunnarsdotter,

I'm sorry for not providing the original record, but I thank you both very much for translating Mamsell. I thought it said "Mamseu" and google translate didn't like that very much.

This time, I'll provide the whole document through the link below. I can't really figure this out but based on what Anti Poika indicated and this particular form, it seems that Carl Ephraim was the son of Joh Rönlund and he was living with his mother and father and siblings, but also with his wife Anna Magdalena Johs and their dotters Anna Ephraim___ and Lovisa Karolina. Does that seem right?

Skellefteå landsförsamling AI:5d (1810-1818), bild 157, sida 137

If the link does not work please see previous thread for a good link.

Best wishes,

Don Kaiser

2020-01-26, 14:15
Svar #26

Utloggad Ingemar Sundewall

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Hello Don,


I think "lady" is a bad translation of "mamsell", since it is a marker for nobility. In the 18th and 19th centuries there were four titles in Sweden that would be used for unmarried women:


1. Fröken - originally only daughters of noblemen, later also upper middle class men (non-noble commissioned officers, wealthy traders, bankers etc.) as well as non-noble owners of larger estates.
2. Mamsell - daughters of tradesmen, master craftsmen, petty officers, sea captains etc. plus professional people like doctors and clergymen.
3. Jungfru - daughters of small-time tradesmen, journeyman craftsmen, merchant ship mates, etc.
4. Piga - daughters of farmers and workers.


Since Lovisa was the daughter of a petty officer she would have been titled "mamsell"

2020-01-26, 16:19
Svar #27

Utloggad Anti Poika

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This time, I'll provide the whole document through the link below. I can't really figure this out but based on what Anti Poika indicated and this particular form, it seems that Carl Ephraim was the son of Joh Rönlund and he was living with his mother and father and siblings, but also with his wife Anna Magdalena Johs and their dotters Anna Ephraim___ and Lovisa Karolina. Does that seem right?

Skellefteå landsförsamling AI:5d (1810-1818), bild 157, sida 137

Yes, you are correct but best thing to do is to also check the birth records to be really sure about parents.
Carl Ephraim first stayed with his parents and siblings until he was married to Anna Magdalena in 1815 and it seems that they stayed in the same or nearby house where their children Anna Euphrosyna/Euphrosyne and Lovisa Carolina was borned.
Mvh Anti

2020-01-26, 22:05
Svar #28

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Anti Poika,

Can I search for and find birth, marriage, and other records like the ones you sent me on this site?

Thank you,

Don

2020-01-26, 23:11
Svar #29

Utloggad Anti Poika

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Dear Don,

Yes, please input Skellefteå landsförsamling at
https://sok.riksarkivet.se/digitala-forskarsalen
Notice the sections of the volumes: A, B, C, D, E and so on. We have been using A and C so far in this thread.
C Födelse- och dopböcker - Birth records
E I Lysnings- och vigselböcker - Marriage records, but they are often found at C.
F Död- och begravningsböcker - Death records, but they are often found at C.
Mvh Anti

2020-01-26, 23:27
Svar #30

Utloggad Anti Poika

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Steps to find Lovisa Carolina 1817.
Mvh Anti

2020-01-27, 03:57
Svar #31

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Thank you for the great resources.  This is amazing.  So much stuff.

I found this record for a possible Lovisa Carolina but it's hard to be certain and I can hardly read anything? What do you think?

https://sok.riksarkivet.se/bildvisning/C0034381_00144#?c=&m=&s=&cv=143&xywh=3429%2C2494%2C1262%2C872

Don

2020-01-27, 05:00
Svar #32

Utloggad Anti Poika

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It´s a good try, but they do not live in "Rafvalsträsk". It should be Bergsbyn as I already looked it up and you have the correct page 449 in my answer #20. Here she is with her parents Carl Rönlund and his wife Anna Maglena Jonsdotter at Bergsbyn. Of course, this is an especially difficult book as the birth and/or bapt. dates have been damaged by the fire... But there are still useful facts.
Mvh Anti

2020-01-27, 05:50
Svar #33

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Rafvalsträsk?  I assume this place was near Skellefteå because it's in the Skellefteå books but I cannot find it today.  Page 449 always mystified me because I could not connect it to Lovisa Carolina born on 25 Sep 1817.

I think I might now see the record on page 449 but the birthday looks different?

2020-01-27, 16:36
Svar #34

Utloggad Anti Poika

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The name always has been Ragvaldsträsk. My reading may be wrong.

Dates can be wrongly written in the books.

=============

Edit 2020-01-28:
Skellefteå landsförsamling AI:1 (1724) Sida 130 - Rawalsträsk
Skellefteå landsförsamling AI:2 (1720-1770) Sida 259 - Rafwalstresk
Skellefteå landsförsamling AI:3b (1771-1801) Sida 157 - Ragwalsträsk
The Table of Contents, "Register", of later date states Ragvaldsträsk.
Mvh Anti

2020-01-27, 16:43
Svar #35

Utloggad Kristina Gunnarsdotter

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Rafval/Rafwal is an old spelling for Ragvald. See Ragvaldsträsk near Skellefteå on this map:
https://kartor.eniro.se/?c=64.684576,20.843811&z=11&q=%22Ragvaldstr%C3%A4sk,%20SKELLEFTE%C3%85%22;207869337;geo

2020-01-27, 23:48
Svar #36

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Thank you Anti Poika and Kristina Gunnarsdotter.

I didn't try "g" as the third letter.  I see now it's Ragvaldsträsk.

So, it's not possible that Lovisa Carolina's mother gave birth to Lovisa in Ragvaldsträsk?


2020-01-28, 00:32
Svar #37

Utloggad Kristina Gunnarsdotter

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I think this is your Lovisa Carolina, left side:
https://sok.riksarkivet.se/bildvisning/C0034381_00153

I add a picture from ArkivDigital. A little easier to read.



2020-01-28, 01:53
Svar #38

Utloggad Anti Poika

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If she was from Ragvaldsträsk has never been a question. You have to check the facts we already have from the household examinations pages. On the page 449 or on Kristinas picture name, the parents, the mothers age (which is about 23,5 but reported as 24) and the place is correct. So this is the birth we are looking for. Her birth date may or may not be correct. Later it always is reported as September 25th.
Mvh Anti

2020-01-28, 04:33
Svar #39

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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I really have to tell you both how much I appreciate your help and your patience with me in trying to decipher these old records. I have to yield to your experience and expertise with both the language and the records, but I have to confess it's a little disconcerting when all of the facts are not right even though at the same time, I realize that's frequently the case with these kinds of records.

Would a complete translation of all the information available in the Bergsbyn record be too much to ask for?

It looks like whoever was tasked with writing down Carl Rönlund's middle name Ephraim, just wrote a line?  That's probably what I would have done too!

2020-01-28, 09:32
Svar #40

Utloggad Anti Poika

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Not all the individuals at the linked pages are part of the family. By looking at all the pages you are able to get a picture of all the children/siblings and if anyone has left the home or come back. Also look up the children in the birth records. You are now able to do this.

As he is called Carl we can suppose Ephraim is his second name, which also is valuable information.
Mvh Anti

2020-01-28, 09:57
Svar #41

Utloggad Anti Poika

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A I/7f (1826-1836) p. 282
Carl Ephr: Rönlund 1791-12-03
Hu Anna Magl: Jons dr (Jöns dr?) 1794-02-14, dead? 1830-01-13
Dr Ana Euphorsina 1816-07-02, moved to Stockholm in 1834
(Dr) Lovisa Carolina 1817-09-25, moved to page 261
(Dr) Mariana Maglena 1819-12-01
Son Johan Wilhelm 1821-07-15, dead 1833-06-04
(Son) Ephraim Ludvig 1823-09-01, moved to page 2
Dr Hedvig Abelona 1826-07-12
(Dr) Amanda Albertina 1828-06-13


A I/8f (1836-1843) p. 468
Carl has married Ulrika Byström b. 1804 in 1837
changed spelling for Anna Euphrosyne, changed date 1816-07-08?
added children:
Son Johan Wilhelm 1840-04-04
Dr Maria Johanna 1844-04-16, dead 1845-07-11
Dr Euphrosyne Johanna 1839-07-29
Dr Ida Carolina 1841-10-20
Dr Hilda Gustava?  1848-07-03
oäkta Dr Maria Lovisa 1847-12-22
Mvh Anti

2020-01-28, 19:26
Svar #42

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Yes, thanks to you, I am now able to search these wonderful old books. I am most grateful. 

Despite the steep learning curve for Americans like me, would you believe that it's actually been easier for me to get family records from Sweden and Germany than from the United States?  Go figure.

Thank you for the translation.

2020-01-28, 19:46
Svar #43

Utloggad Anti Poika

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Go figure.

Yes, I guess so and I have seen too many more or less bad American records of Swedes claimed as sources. Better to discover the real sources!
Mvh Anti

2020-01-30, 00:41
Svar #44

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Dear Anti Poika,

Your translation above sets right my misconception that Lovisa Carolina Rönnlund was the mother of Hilda Gustave Rönnlund. In fact, they were half-sisters despite their age difference. They traveled to America together in 1893.

Was "oäkta Dr Maria Lovisa 1847-12-22" necessarily a child of Ulrika Byström or could she be an illegitimate child of one of the daughters?

Is it possible to see the other page referenced for Lovisa Carolina?

Don

2020-01-30, 01:36
Svar #45

Utloggad Anti Poika

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Hello Don,

Well, AI:10h (1853-1863) p. 354 indicates some connections with "+" signs. So why not check this in the Skellefteå landsf. C/9 (1831-1847) record as Maria Lovisa was born in 1847. We will at page 335 find the fact that she was the illegitimate daughter of Lovisa Carolina Rönlund.

It is not clear to me which page ref. for Lovisa Carolina you do want to see.
Mvh Anti

2020-01-30, 04:00
Svar #46

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Aha!  Another one. Sad, she seems to have died in her prime in 1865.

Can you see the cause of death?

2020-01-30, 05:14
Svar #47

Utloggad Anti Poika

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Difterit (difteri), which is diphteria.
https://medical-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/Diphtheritis
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diphtheritis

Remember, for painless genealogy - always state the source. A picture is good but it is not a discription of where to find the source.


And here is the original source where it´s not possible to read the death cause:
Skellefteå landsförsamlings kyrkoarkiv, Död- och begravningsböcker, SE/HLA/1010174/F/1 (1815-1865), bildid: C0034392_00156, sida 138
Mvh Anti

2020-01-30, 06:08
Svar #48

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Aha.  Thank you.  I thought maybe it was that. 

Do you have any advice for what to enter to find birth records from Björkenas?

2020-01-30, 11:53
Svar #49

Utloggad Anti Poika

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Hmm, Björkenas, what´s that?  :D
1. First try to locate it on a map.
2. Then search for a "socken" or parish where you can find the place.
Mvh Anti

2020-01-30, 12:02
Svar #50

Utloggad Kristina Gunnarsdotter

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Just look at the page in my answer nr 12. There you see that Sven is born in Hällaryd (parish) in Blekinge county. And his father Jonas is mentioned further down, born in the same place 1804.

Hällaryd (K) CI:7 (1845-1861) Bild 59 / sid 55 (AID: v95867.b59.s55, NAD: SE/LLA/13167)
Hällaryd (K) AI:9 (1846-1852) Bild 266 / sid 261 (AID: v95845.b266.s261, NAD: SE/LLA/13167)

And so on...
PS I give you the references for Arkiv Digital because it is easier to find the records there.

Maybe you already have read this information in English about how to research your Swedish ancestors.
https://www.rotter.se/swedish-roots/finding-your-swedish-roots

2020-01-30, 21:48
Svar #51

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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I must have been searching in a different series of Hällaryds records because the year groupings were different than what you specified and I could not find Sven. But after finding another record group with the same year groupings that you specified, I found this:

https://sok.riksarkivet.se/bildvisning/C0057405_00064#?c=&m=&s=&cv=63&xywh=1538%2C1229%2C3097%2C2302

It mentions Björkenas but what is the context? Can I learn the sponsors, Godparents, or more?

Many thanks.


2020-01-30, 22:42
Svar #52

Utloggad Kalle Birgersson

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I must have been searching in a different series of Hällaryds records because the year groupings were different than what you specified and I could not find Sven. But after finding another record group with the same year groupings that you specified, I found this:

https://sok.riksarkivet.se/bildvisning/C0057405_00064#?c=&m=&s=&cv=63&xywh=1538%2C1229%2C3097%2C2302

It mentions Björkenas but what is the context? Can I learn the sponsors, Godparents, or more?

Many thanks.
The person on the first row should be the godmother or at least she carried the child to the baptism. The farmer Nils Svensson's wife Hanna Persdotter in Lyckö. Next line should be the sponsors, farmer Håkan Håkansson and mrs. Elna Carlsdotter in ? and farmhand/unmarried man Nils Persson at Hagakullen. They could be relatives to the child or just friends or neighbours.Also you have the age of the mother, 40 years.

2020-01-31, 00:01
Svar #53

Utloggad Kristina Gunnarsdotter

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The abbreviation is Susc. = Susceptrix = godmother. The witness wife Elna Carlsdotter is from Björkenäs.
The title of the father is former churchwarden.

I don't understand when you say that the year groupings were different. Here are pages from Riksarkivet and Arkiv Digital with the serie C = books of births.



2020-01-31, 00:25
Svar #54

Utloggad Kristina Gunnarsdotter

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Björkenäs is north of Hällaryd. I guess you know that björk=birch. Sven took his name from his birthplace and moved to the City of birches, Umeå.
https://kartor.eniro.se/?c=56.219925,14.947929&z=13

2020-01-31, 04:53
Svar #55

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Thank you to Kalle Birgersson, Kristina Gunnarsdotter, and Anti Poika for you excellent replies.

Yes Kristina, you are correct. According to family lore, Sven did indeed take his name from his home of Björkenäs. I don't know exactly what it means but it does have björk (birch) in it. I also have no idea why he moved to Umeå and it doesn't seem reasonable that he went all the way up there because it was the city of birches? Would Västerbotten be known as Lapland?

Regarding the year groupings, under Hällaryd, I was looking in C Födelse- och dopböcker. Here the years were grouped as shown in the attachment, which is different from the year groupings you provided, which of course is where we found the records for Jonas (4 Oct 1804), Sven (8 Jan 1851), and his sister Carin (13 Feb 1852).

Any info you can provide from the attachments would be most appreciated.


2020-01-31, 06:36
Svar #56

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Is it right from your map that Björkenäs has only two houses?  If so, maybe I  have a good chance of finding Jonas Svensson's home?

I also found this record for who I think might be Sven and Carin's brother John:

https://sok.riksarkivet.se/bildvisning/C0057404_00051#?c=&m=&s=&cv=50&xywh=-9%2C-12%2C6520%2C4847

Looks like my other documents may have not attached so I'm providing the links:

Jonas Svensson born 4 Oct 1804: https://sok.riksarkivet.se/bildvisning/C0057403_00037#?c=&m=&s=&cv=36&xywh=351%2C333%2C2876%2C2138

Carin Svensson born 13 Feb 1852: https://sok.riksarkivet.se/bildvisning/C0057405_00074#?c=&m=&s=&cv=73&xywh=180%2C931%2C4988%2C3708

Otto Svensson born 8 Aug 1848: https://sok.riksarkivet.se/bildvisning/C0057405_00041#?c=&m=&s=&cv=40&xywh=307%2C2375%2C3896%2C2896





2020-01-31, 08:13
Svar #57

Utloggad Kalle Birgersson

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Is it right from your map that Björkenäs has only two houses?  If so, maybe I  have a good chance of finding Jonas Svensson's home?
It seems like Jonas Svensson lived in the house to the left, which is where the real farm is today, the house to the right does not have any barns, stables or anything like that. I found an old document with maps and info from 1851, I will try linking it but I don't know if it is possible. You will also need a special program to view it.

https://historiskakartor.lantmateriet.se/historiskakartor/show.html?showmap=true&archive=REG&nbOfImages=32&sd_base=lm10&sd_ktun=000493ib&mdat=20170619155428928572


2020-01-31, 09:20
Svar #58

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Dear Kalle Birgersson,

Wow!  Fantastic!  The map even has Jonas Svensson's name on it, supposedly labeling his farm?

I'm very grateful to you for finding this gem.

Don Kaiser

2020-01-31, 14:32
Svar #59

Utloggad Kristina Gunnarsdotter

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Beautiful map!
In the 1800-hundreds when a big part of the rural population moved to the cities or emigrated or learned a profession many took a new name instead of their common patronymic name.

Björklund: björk = birch, lund = grove. This type of name with elements from the nature is very common in Sweden.
Björkenäs: björk = birch, näs = point (the e is just a connecting letter).

Västerbotten and Lappland are both geographic areas, landskap/province. Västerbottens län/region/county is the administrative area for the province Västerbotten, southern Lappland, northern Ångermanland and a small part of Jämtland.

Sven did not move straight from Blekinge to Västerbotten. He was some time in Malmö, Skåne, and maybe other places. Tracing a person from death to birth, step by step, is the traditional and recommended way to explore your family history. The household records are the main source. Then you confirm your founds in the birth/marriage/death books.

I cannot figure out what your picture shows. Please give a link or a headline. No church books i Hällaryd start in 1638 as far as I can see. The first book of births is CI:1, 1647- 1702.

Here are the addresses to the household books, backwards from AI:10 (where the family moves to Edestad parish) to AI:3 where Jonas Svensson and Elna Persdotter start their family and no children are born yet.

Hällaryd (K) AI:10 (1852-1859) Bild 312 / sid 308 (AID: v95846.b312.s308, NAD: SE/LLA/13167)
Hällaryd (K) AI:9 (1846-1852) Bild 266 / sid 261 (AID: v95845.b266.s261, NAD: SE/LLA/13167)
Hällaryd (K) AI:8 (1841-1846) Bild 244 / sid 238 (AID: v95844.b244.s238, NAD: SE/LLA/13167)
Hällaryd (K) AI:7 (1838-1841) Bild 222 / sid 219 (AID: v95843.b222.s219, NAD: SE/LLA/13167)
Hällaryd (K) AI:6 (1835-1838) Bild 255 / sid 245 (AID: v95842.b255.s245, NAD: SE/LLA/13167)
Hällaryd (K) AI:5 (1831-1834) Bild 197 / sid 188 (AID: v95841.b197.s188, NAD: SE/LLA/13167)
Hällaryd (K) AI:4 (1827-1830) Bild 181 / sid 176 (AID: v95840.b181.s176, NAD: SE/LLA/13167)
Hällaryd (K) AI:3 (1824-1826) Bild 177 / sid 170 (AID: v95839.b177.s170, NAD: SE/LLA/13167)








2020-01-31, 17:29
Svar #60

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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I think Jonas Svensson may also have been a wanderer. I think he went to Ronneby for a while, went back to Björkenäs, and of course we know he ended up in Umeå.

I think his son Otto went to Germany, Copenhagen, Elfborg, and the U.S. perhaps but I am not sure about that?

Is there a Swedish name for Joseph?  I don't see many Josephs around.

Thanks,

Don Kaiser

2020-01-31, 17:39
Svar #61

Utloggad Kalle Birgersson

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Is there a Swedish name for Joseph?  I don't see many Josephs around.
It is spelled Josef here, but was never very common in the old days. You see it every now and then today, but the female version Josefin is probably more common.

2020-02-01, 07:00
Svar #62

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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OK, so it's Josef then. Maybe Josef Svensson was born outside of Hällaryd because I cannot find his birth there in 1840 or 1841.

2020-02-01, 07:39
Svar #63

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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2020-02-06, 08:30
Svar #64

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Dear Kalle Birgersson,

On your 1851 map showing Björkenäs, there is "ölla sjön." I assume it's a lake but what does ölla mean? Is the lake still named the same today?  I also found the word maderna, which seems to mean swamp?  Do you think there are owls there?

Best wishes,

Don Kaiser

2020-02-06, 12:26
Svar #65

Utloggad Anti Poika

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Hello Don,

I did some research.

The name of the lake today is Södra Öllesjön or Björkenässjön.
In the 17th century it was connected to Norra Öllesjön and was called Ölsiön

http://www.isof.se/sprak/namn/ortnamn/ortnamnsregistret/sok-i-registret.html
> Blekinge
> Search - Ortnamn: ölle%

In 1680 the lake was called Ölsiön
https://www4.isof.se/NAU/bilder/_s2kx001/120207d1/p2/0001299a.pdf

According to SAOL ölle has no meaning as a word in Swedish. https://svenska.se/

Öl in Swedish means beer in English.
Öl in German means oil in Swedish.

_


mad, maden, mader • sank ängsmark
It´s not exactly the same as swamp. You could say it´s somewhere in between a meadowland and a swamp as it is damp.
sankmark = fen

_


I leave the question of the owls for Kalle to answer. ;)

Kind regards,
Mvh Anti

2020-02-06, 14:48
Svar #66

Utloggad Kalle Birgersson

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I leave the question of the owls for Kalle to answer. ;)

Kind regards,
And I'm sure there are owls there, they are everywhere in Sweden!  :)
But that lake, Öllesjön, I have a theory. Vowels change more than other parts of words, and it might not have been Ö allways. What if it was once Alesjön, or Ällesjön? Al is the swedish name for the tree Alder, a wetland tree growing in riparian areas all over the country. And a group of alders was called "Ale" or "Äle" or even "Älle". There is even a farm in Hällaryd parish that is called "Ällestad". Stad means place and Älle means a stand of alder trees.

http://www.isof.se/download/18.5850f85e15732ead0b319be/1529495844281/Ortnamnen%20i%20Blekinge%20l%C3%A4n%20Br%C3%A4kne%20h%C3%A4rad.pdf

2020-02-06, 22:21
Svar #67

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Anti Poika and Kalle Birgersson,

I thank you both for your wonderful replies. I had no idea that my simple question about the name of a lake and marsh would produce such an interesting discussion about language, ecology, and botany.

I was struck by the idea that the name of the lake may have been derived from the name of the alder tree because we are talking about a place called Björkenäs, also named for a tree, although I don't know the actual meaning of Björkenäs? I don't know if you have ash trees, but they happen to be relatives of olive trees and the family name in Latin is Oleaceae. Do you think the lake may have been named for ash trees? In Norse mythology, "The first man, Ask, was formed from the "ash tree" according to Wikipedia.

Google maps indicates many more buildings in Björkenäs than just the two I noticed on one of the earlier maps in this discussion. I forgot to ask if all of the other information (pages of text) on the webpage with the 1851 map Björkenäs is an historical description of the place, or maybe something else?

Regarding the owls, I was actually hoping to make you laugh or discuss the expression "ugler i mosen," although that might be strictly Danish.

Don

2020-02-06, 22:32
Svar #68

Utloggad Kristina Gunnarsdotter

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About the meaning of names see my answer no 59.

2020-02-06, 22:50
Svar #69

Utloggad Kalle Birgersson

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Näs means peninsula. Actually it comes from nose, a thing that sticks out. Not from a face this time, but a piece of land sticking out in a body of water. And on this particular peninsula there was many birch trees when they first settled the area, at least 500 years ago. Place names from nature formations are extremely common in Sweden and Björkenäs is very basic. There are probably dozens, if not hundreds of Björkenäs around the country.

Öllesjön probably got its name hundreds of years before ash trees got their scientific name. So even if there was ash trees around the lake, they didn't name it.

That historic map is from a "hemmansklyvning", they sold a part of the farm to someone and since ownership of land always has been serious busines it has to be measured and recorded.

2020-02-06, 23:10
Svar #70

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Kristina Gunnarsdotter - I'm sorry for not being completely satisfied with "birch point."  But certainly on each of the maps there is a prominent promontory that likely had birches, although we'll probably never know what the place looked like hundreds of years ago when it got its name. Maybe birch trees occupy that conspicuous point today?

Thank you Kalle Birgersson. I have noticed at least two other Björkenäs in the same general area of southern Sweden, Very confusing. If I rely on google maps, I get the wrong place. Thanks to all of you, I have the right one.

One things for certain, there are owls everywhere in Sweden!

2020-02-06, 23:24
Svar #71

Utloggad Anti Poika

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Why not use the word ness or naze for näs as we not only find common origins in ancestry but also in language.

This area was actually a part of Denmark in the 16th century. As the lake was called Ölsjön in the 17th century. I believe that later when the south Swedish dialects had developed further from the Danish language in it's own way, e.g. the name Öllesjön originated from  the somewhat cloudy speech down there. :)
http://mail.blekingemuseum.se/pdf/katalog_blekinges_dansktid.pdf

Here is a text for your Swedish language practice about ugglor i mossen, as it is spelled in Swedish.
Mvh Anti

2020-02-07, 03:38
Svar #72

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Aha!  So before there were owls in the bog, there were wolves in the bog. Wolves would be a much better reason for suspicion or concern. But perhaps the wise old owls represent an awareness of suspicious deeds and causes for concern as well?

I assume you were making fun of the Danish language and not the dialect of southern Sweden. If it's the latter, it would seem that I am a descendant of people from places where language is somewhat compromised. My grandfather spoke fluent German but failed German in his high school class in New York. This always puzzled me to no end. But then I heard that the dialect of the part of Württemberg from which he came is very strange. Are you telling me that my Hällaryd relatives also spoke a strange dialect?

2020-02-07, 04:35
Svar #73

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Google translate translation from Anti Poika's reference on Blekinge:

Björkenäs baokancbs 112 so-called. - [Birckemis 1583] -nis 1591
Bierckenes 1595 Birchennes 1604 Birche- 1612 Bierckens 1642 Birekenes 1651 Birkenääs 1658 1686 -näs 1673 Börke- 1680 [Böke- 1715]
Börcke- 1725 Björcke- 1795 Björkenäs 1825 1871 jb. - Birckenäsz 1624
Prästrel. p. 188 Björkenäs G ek bek. In March 1583-1651 a hymn, 1658-
1715 kr. F. led. it is neutral. collective formation birch 'stock of
birches'. S. nose's nose refers to a projecting ground area in S. Alleesjön.

http://mail.blekingemuseum.se/pdf/katalog_blekinges_dansktid.pdf

2020-02-07, 04:42
Svar #74

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2020-02-07, 07:07
Svar #75

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Do you think I have labeled Björkenäs correctly on the attached map?

2020-02-07, 08:09
Svar #76

Utloggad Kalle Birgersson

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I assume you were making fun of the Danish language and not the dialect of southern Sweden. If it's the latter, it would seem that I am a descendant of people from places where language is somewhat compromised. My grandfather spoke fluent German but failed German in his high school class in New York. This always puzzled me to no end. But then I heard that the dialect of the part of Württemberg from which he came is very strange. Are you telling me that my Hällaryd relatives also spoke a strange dialect?
Blekinge was conquered from Denmark in the 1600s and even if they were forced to learn swedich their dialect allways sounded a bit danish. Same goes for my part of Sweden, that was conquered from Norway, we have a lot of norwegian words in our dialect. And for the people in the old Svealand part of Sweden this sounds funny...


2020-02-07, 08:16
Svar #77

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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I read somewhere that the last hostilities on Swedish soil were ~1812 when the Russians came down near Skellefteå. Was this part of Sweden ever a part of Russia or Finland and does their dialect reflect this fact?

2020-02-07, 09:00
Svar #78

Utloggad Kalle Birgersson

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I read somewhere that the last hostilities on Swedish soil were ~1812 when the Russians came down near Skellefteå. Was this part of Sweden ever a part of Russia or Finland and does their dialect reflect this fact?
Skellefteå has always been swedish, or maybe the sami people was there before but if so that was really long ago. But they have a very strange dialect up there anyway, called "bondska", best translated to "farmer". A dialect with many old traits, lost by the faster evolving language further south. But of course these days dialects are fading away when people has TV, radio and moves around cross country all the time.

2020-02-08, 03:26
Svar #79

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Can anyone tell me what N 40 Björkenäs means?

Also on this link, what does No. 3 Binga mean? And can anyone possibly decipher all of the scribbling on the right hand side?

https://sok.riksarkivet.se/bildvisning/C0057090_00020#?c=&m=&s=&cv=19&xywh=244%2C487%2C2806%2C1631


2020-02-08, 16:05
Svar #80

Utloggad Anti Poika

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These numbers show how the farms of the village are numbered in the household examination records and in which order this has been made was the clergy's choice.

The scribbling is about having applied for the Royal Majesty's permission to enter into marriage,  even though he was of underage when banns was issued in april 1861, or so...

Sökt Kongliga Majts Nådiga tillåtelse att fastän min-
derårig få ingå äktenskap med Martha(?) (?)´s dotter i B...
Mvh Anti

2020-02-08, 21:56
Svar #81

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Dear Anti Poika,

It's a wonder anyone can understand the wrods coming out of my moth considering that my ancestors came from Württemberg, Björkenäs, and Skellefteå.

Thank you for your explanation about the numbers. I guess this means that when I see "No. 40 Björkenäs" in two different household examination records, I should not assume that it is the same physical house?

For "No. 3 Binga" in Edestad, what does "Binga" mean? Is it a place like Björkenäs?

I suppose Sweden was like Württemberg and people needed to be ~25-years-old to get married or have adult status.

I think my grandfather's uncle Sven Jonasson was born on 25 Feb 1828 but I am having trouble finding his birth record. Can you determine which one it is on this page:

https://sok.riksarkivet.se/bildvisning/C0057403_00224#?c=&m=&s=&cv=223&xywh=-472%2C336%2C4605%2C2747

I see the names of his supposed parents Jonas Svensson and Elna Pehrsdotter on several records but I cannot find the name Sven or his supposed birthdate and baptism date.

I hope I'm not imposing on the kindness of this group by asking so many questions. You guys have really opened up a Pandora's box for me and I am very grateful.

Best wishes,

Don


2020-02-09, 00:55
Svar #82

Utloggad Anti Poika

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Sehr geehrter Herr Don Kaiser,

Ich werde auf keinen Fall arbeitslos sein, wenn es um Ihre Fragen geht!  ;) :D

As you browsed this book looking for Svens birth you have landed on a page with weddings.
I found Sven by browsing backwards from the birth year 1829 (linked at the left margin).

Hällaryd CI:5 (1794-1829), bild 196, sida 341

Bonden Jonas Svenssons och hustru Elna Pehrs
dotter i Björkenäs Son Sven. Suse:(Suceptrix/Gudmor) Kyrkov.
John Hanssons i Svinaryd hustru Nilla Pehrs dr (Pehrsdotter).
Testes  Bonden Nils Olsson i Pehrsgärde. Drängen
Håken(?) Jönsson i Törneryd Drängen Nils Svensson
i Björkenäs, hustru Elna Olas dr i Törneryd
Pigan Ingeborg Nils dr i Qwallåkra. Modr.(modren/modern/Svens mother) 18 år kt:(kyrktagen, received to the parish) 30/3
Mvh Anti

2020-02-09, 21:50
Svar #83

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Sonntagsüberschrift:

Amateurgealogen mit seltsamem Dialekt hilft, die Arbeitslosigkeit auf ein neues Tief zu treiben.

Thank you very much Anti Poika for finding the correct birth and baptism record for Sven Jonasson. Now I know what a marriage record looks like:

https://sok.riksarkivet.se/bildvisning/C0057403_00222#?c=&m=&s=&cv=221&xywh=3145%2C2220%2C2708%2C1457

Can you tell where the 17 Jun 1826 wedding took place for Jonas Svensson and Elna Pehrsdotter?

2020-02-09, 22:47
Svar #84

Utloggad Anti Poika

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 :D ;D

The place where weddings took place is seldom announced in the records, but it most often implicitly means the church of the parish, so it can be difficult to know which if there are two. So Hällaryds kyrka is my first bet. My second bet is Åryds kyrka as it also belonged to the vicarage. Please, try to check which one is most close to Björkenäs or Persgärde.

Your earlier question about what the name of the place Binga means I am not able to answer. It is not ersichtlich. But Ortnamnsregistret or  'The Place name registry at the Institute for Language and Folklore' tells about where to find the explanation by the help of etymology research.
https://www4.isof.se/NAU/bilder/_s2kx001/120211d1/p1/0000017a.pdf
https://www4.isof.se/NAU/bilder/_s2kx001/120211d1/p1/0000018a.pdf

Here you get some pseudoscience:
Ortnamn i Blekinge
Mvh Anti

2020-02-10, 00:28
Svar #85

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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I agree with you, the Hällaryd church is in Hällaryd but the other is in Kalrshamn, 8 km to the SW. As you know, Persgärde, which seems not to have a church of its own?, is twice as far north of Hällaryd as Björkenäs. Thanks for the links. Unfortunately, the church seems to be a newer structure than where Jonas went.

2020-02-10, 04:32
Svar #86

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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I don't know if it's the right Binga, but it is listed as a place in Edestad Parish:

https://www.familysearch.org/wiki/en/Edestad_Parish,_Blekinge,_Sweden_Genealogy

Your two references suggest it is or was a place near Edestad too.

2020-02-10, 09:30
Svar #87

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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2020-02-12, 05:32
Svar #88

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Hello,

Does anyone know what the numbers were for each of the houses/farms (squares) in Binga on the attached map?  The Household examinations and other records refer to "Binga No. 3," No. 2, No. 1, etc. It would be interesting to know the numbers. Perhaps there is a map with numbers?

http://diginpast.se/ostkanten/kartor/eng/edes.html

2020-02-12, 09:30
Svar #89

Utloggad KG Hammarlund

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The Swedish Land Survey Authorities have digitized a lot of historical maps:
https://historiskakartor.lantmateriet.se/arken/s/advancedsearch.html

For Binga, there's a map made during the "Storskifte" 1809 that have some of the farm numbers and may be of help or interest:

https://historiskakartor.lantmateriet.se/arken/s/show.html?showmap=true&mapTypeSelected=false&mapType=&archive=LMS&nbOfImages=3&sd_base=lms2&sd_ktun=4c4d535f4931342d323a36

You'll need the djvu plugin for viewing the maps in your browser.

2020-02-12, 23:00
Svar #90

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Dear KG Hammarlund,

Thank you for your link to the maps page and the map of Binga. It's a little hard for me to put it into perspective with regards to my 1870 map but I suppose that's because your map is much older. Much appreciated though!

Don

2020-02-12, 23:24
Svar #91

Utloggad Anti Poika

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Don,

Unfortunately, how the houses are numbered in the household examination records most often have no correlation to numbers on a map anyway.
Mvh Anti

2020-02-12, 23:32
Svar #92

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Dear Anto Poika,

Yes, I remember you said that. So when I see Binga No. 3 and Binga No. 4 on this 1857 map, I should not presume that is where people in the 1862-1870 household examination books lived and farmed?

2020-02-12, 23:50
Svar #93

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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I don't need a complete translation but could someone please give me an idea of what is going on in this document?

2020-02-13, 00:12
Svar #94

Utloggad Anti Poika

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Yes, I remember you said that. So when I see Binga No. 3 and Binga No. 4 on this 1857 map, I should not presume that is where people in the 1862-1870 household examination books lived and farmed?

When you are trying to find Edestad AI:9 (1856-1862) picture 20 on a map you at first need a contemporary map, eg. from the second half of the 19th century. Of course, you can't be absolutely sure about the location, not just because there were five families who lived at Binga No. 3 during this period. There are five pages for No. 3 and these households might have been a spin off of an older farm No. 3. So they probably did not live together in one house. The best information will probably be obtained by talking to the people or relatives who live there today.
Mvh Anti

2020-02-13, 00:34
Svar #95

Utloggad Anti Poika

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I don't need a complete translation but could someone please give me an idea of what is going on in this document?

The text is an establishment of a contract where Carl Svensson makes available a part of the territory belonging to Binga No. 3 to the Parish for everlasting time, for a school area against an annual payment of SEK 3. The trees belong to the seller, etc. Access will take place the next October.
This contract will, in order to become valid, be subjected to the ordination of the church clergy and, as on behalf of the congregation, will be instructed to state and sign this contract, suggest that the place may be named Bingalund. This happened at Binga on May 28, 1877.
Mvh Anti

2020-02-13, 09:06
Svar #96

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Dear Anti Poika,

Thanks for explaining that document. This is really interesting to me because I think Carl Svensson was probably my great grandfather's brother.  I really appreciate knowing that he leased land to the church for a school.  It makes me wonder if the family was very religious because Carl's father (Jonas Svensson?) was a church warden (whatever that was?) back in Björkenäs before the family moved to Binga. Or, maybe they needed help and the church found ways to help them get by? Or, maybe it was just business as usual?  Anyway, it's interesting. Thanks.

The entire document is actually about 10 pages:

https://historiskakartor.lantmateriet.se/arken/s/show.html?archive=REG&showmap=true&searchType=v&nbOfImages=12&sd_base=lm10&sd_ktun=000490on&mdat=20170619160351045354&p=2

Maybe there's something important I'd like to know in there?

Best wishes,

Don

2020-02-13, 10:24
Svar #97

Utloggad KG Hammarlund

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Hi Don,

I won't think that the lease agreement says anything about religiousity or help from the church to get by.
Ever since 1688, the church (parish) was responsible for seeing to that people could read and write. With the introduction of the Folkskola 1842 all parishes were obliged to offer formal schooling, and school houses were built all over the country. And of course they had to be built somewhere. If the parish didn't own land it would be necessary to buy or lease.

The building  of over 2,000 school houses over a period of less than 50 years was an impressive task, probably greater in terms of manpower and money than the Göta Kanal channel project.

2020-02-13, 10:32
Svar #98

Utloggad KG Hammarlund

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Don,

Unfortunately, how the houses are numbered in the household examination records most often have no correlation to numbers on a map anyway.

I wonder if that holds for villages in Blekinge and Kristianstad counties. I've traced a number of ancestors there, and the use of numbers (e.g. Mörrum 41, Dyneboda 2) is so consistent (in birth records, marriage records, hfl) that I've got the impression that this was the official names of the farms. Probably not used in everyday parlance by the farmers, but still something different to other parts of Sweden where you find the Norregård, Södergård and so on.

Maybe this has something to do with these counties' Danish history.

2020-02-13, 18:19
Svar #99

Utloggad Kristina Gunnarsdotter

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I agree with KG. My experience from Blekinge (Mörrum, Gammalstorp, Ysane) is that the number of the place/farm was the same over time. In the 1900s it also became the postal address.
I have some changes in the numbers which I think has to do with the "laga skifte".

2020-02-13, 21:08
Svar #100

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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For a minute there Karin Gunnarsdotter I thought you were agreeing with yourself when you said, "I agree with KG."

Personally, I have no knowledge of Swedish culture, so I have no reason or ability to agree with either you or KG Hammarlund.

But I do tend to agree with myself all the time and I keep finding my relatives associated with this place called Binga No. 3 in numerous records from 1855 into the 20th century so I can only assume it was the place where they lived. Prior to 1855, they were associated with a place called No. 40 Björkenäs in Hällaryd Parish. In the back of my mind, I've sort of thought about these numbers as a way of naming parcels of land (lots) used primarily for farming. But this is likely because I just happen to know about William Penn's Nottingham Lots, which were parcels of land numbered 1-37 and used for farming in Pennsylvania and Maryland.

Maybe Carl Svensson didn't want his kids to have to go all the way to Edestad for school, so he offered to have a new school built on his own land.

I really appreciate all of your comments and insights.  It's really very interesting to me.

2020-02-13, 23:35
Svar #101

Utloggad KG Hammarlund

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Maybe Carl Svensson didn't want his kids to have to go all the way to Edestad for school, so he offered to have a new school built on his own land.

You may have a point there, although he probably wasn't alone, since the parish assembly (local farmers) were willing to approve the lease. I found some information that the school in Binga was a small one, for the youngest children (7-9 years). After that they had to go to Edestad. I even found a photo of it: http://diginpast.se/bb/peggy/index.html

2020-02-14, 00:11
Svar #102

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Wow - nice! Binga småskola. I wonder if it's the same one on Carl Svensson's farm?

2020-02-14, 06:58
Svar #103

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Can anyone make out the names of the parents of Elna Pehrsdotter, born 19 Mar 1810? Is there a location?

https://sok.riksarkivet.se/bildvisning/C0057403_00049#?c=&m=&s=&cv=48&xywh=3690%2C3245%2C1582%2C944

2020-02-14, 07:25
Svar #104

Utloggad Kalle Birgersson

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Pehr Olsson and Anna Nilsdotter in Pärsgärde

2020-02-14, 07:30
Svar #105

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Great! Thank you! Is Pärsgärde the same as Pehrsgärde?

2020-02-14, 07:45
Svar #106

Utloggad Kalle Birgersson

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Yes, just different spelling

2020-02-14, 08:06
Svar #107

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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2020-02-14, 09:12
Svar #108

Utloggad KG Hammarlund

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Wow - nice! Binga småskola. I wonder if it's the same one on Carl Svensson's farm?

Most likely, the school house looks like it could have been built in the 1870's, maybe with some later changes.
I also found these memories of school days at Binga school, but of a much later date: 1950's or early 60's. Run it through google translate and it's quite intelligible.
http://flickaningrid.blogspot.com/2006/10/04-smskolan.html

2020-02-14, 09:33
Svar #109

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Very interesting. Where do you find this stuff?

Reminds me of when I was a boy and had to walk 5 miles to and from school in the snow uphill- both ways.

2020-02-14, 10:50
Svar #110

Utloggad KG Hammarlund

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I'm a hell of a googler  ;D
and it's of course much easier when you have a grasp of local, regional, and national contexts, juggling with search terms such as 'skolhus', 'småskola', 'folkskola'. Plus that school buildings is one of my pet interests.

2020-02-14, 19:30
Svar #111

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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"Det var långt mellan skolorna i Binga och Edestad."

Do you happen to know anything about the school(s) near Björkenäs, Hällaryd, Blekinge around 1840-1855? I believe you said the folkskola started in 1842, so maybe they had no school at that time other than the church school, likely in Hällaryd.

2020-02-14, 19:59
Svar #112

Utloggad KG Hammarlund

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1840-55 is very early, it often took some time to get the school in place. I don't know about Hällaryd. Google reveals that there was a school in Siggarp.
The local heritage association might know more:
https://www.hembygd.se/aryd/page/28612

2020-02-14, 20:59
Svar #113

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Thank you KG.  Nice site.

I searched for Björkenäs and found some interesting photos and names but when I clicked "show on map" it took me to the wrong location.

The Björkenäs I am interested is pretty far north of Siggarp between Hällaryd and Pehrsgärde near Södra Öllesjön but it doesn't appear on most maps - like google. Maybe Pehrsgärde had a school?


2020-02-14, 21:21
Svar #114

Utloggad KG Hammarlund

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A map of Hällaryd from around 1915:
https://historiskakartor.lantmateriet.se/historiskakartor/show.html?showmap=true&archive=RAK&archive=RAK&sd_base=rak2&sd_ktun=52414b5f4a3131322d342d3233

I looked for the legend "Skolhus" but could only find 2: Hällaryd and Siggarp. And Pehrsnäs doesn't show up either.

Here's a short overview over the Swedish educational system and its history, including the Folkskola:
http://www.hhogman.se/school-history-sweden.htm

2020-02-14, 22:11
Svar #115

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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This map is very helpful for another reason.  I have tried unsuccessfully to locate a place called Lyckö. I see from your map that it's an island in the lake! I suppose my relatives had boats.

Pehrsgärde should be just north - off the top of the map.

Thanks!

2020-02-14, 23:34
Svar #116

Utloggad KG Hammarlund

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2020-02-15, 00:37
Svar #117

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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I tried stitching the two maps together. They don't align perfectly but it's OK to compare the two regions to each other. I hope my attachment is not too big.

Thanks for finding these.

2020-02-15, 04:23
Svar #118

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Could someone please interpret the written-in writing above Line 1 (baker) on this page?

https://sok.riksarkivet.se/bildvisning/C0034468_00102#?c=&m=&s=&cv=101&xywh=93%2C544%2C1930%2C1011

2020-02-15, 04:31
Svar #119

Utloggad Leif Lundkvist

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No 103 Owners J A Olsson, A E Grahn and N Säfström.

2020-02-15, 04:52
Svar #120

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Dear Leif Lundkvist,

Thanks!  Is it No. 103 Timmermannen?  Is that a street name - or a place?


2020-02-15, 05:07
Svar #121

Utloggad Leif Lundkvist

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Timmermannen is a block/quarter name and 103 is a city wide property number. Typically a block contain around 10 properties.

2020-02-15, 05:21
Svar #122

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Thank you Lief.  Are those block/quarter names and city wide property numbers the same places in different household examinations?

2020-02-15, 05:35
Svar #123

Utloggad Leif Lundkvist

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Yes, they are usually the same over a long time, but sometimes changes, sometimes due to name or numbering changes, sometimes due to a new city plan.

2020-02-15, 05:48
Svar #124

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Great!  Thank you very much!

2020-02-15, 07:34
Svar #125

Utloggad KG Hammarlund

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And of course there's a map  :D (another pet interest of mine, as you might have guessed)

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e3/Stadsplan_Ume%C3%A5_stad_med_Haga_1899.jpg

You'll find the block Timmermannen to the left, under the map title.

2020-02-15, 07:54
Svar #126

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Wow - you are good HG!  I've been looking for a map of this place too.

But this is after Umea was rebuilt after the big fire of 1888, so maybe it's a different location?

2020-02-15, 08:34
Svar #127

Utloggad KG Hammarlund

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The fire did not spread to the west of the avenue "Vestra Esplanaden". So Timmermannen should have been OK.
At the same time it's a bit odd that the block looks completely empty. Two hypothetical explanations:
1) After the fire, provisional barracks were put up. These were later demolished and replaced with new buildings, or
2) there was an earlier block Timmermannen somewhere else in Umeå, destroyed in the fire.

But since your ancestors lived in (where registered as living in) Timmermannen till 1893, I would go for the first hypothesis. Either they lived in one of the barracks, or in an older house that the town council found ripe for demolishing, creating space for much needed housing. In either case, the block might have been cleared some time between 1893 and 1899.

Someone with good insights in Umeå's town planning should know more.

EDIT: Some more information and pics from the western parts of Umeå on pages 6-7 here: https://www.umea.se/download/18.3f589399144bbe9c366b80f/1396859264415/V%C3%A4st%20uppslag%20A3.pdf

The streets and blocks apparently were drawn up in the 1870's. On an older map (1857), the area was called 'Amerika'! The Wild West, I guess...


2020-02-15, 17:39
Svar #128

Utloggad Leif Lundkvist

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Today that block is merged with the block to the east, Snickaren, Sandgatan is removed, and the whole new block is named Snickaren. That explains why I could not find it today, Timmermannen is no more.

2020-02-15, 19:17
Svar #129

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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KG,

One of the captions from your interesting pdf is about Kvarteret Bagaren:

"Den del av Umeå som låg närmast väster om stadens rutnätsplan kallades på 1857 års karta Amerika. Här fanns då en oreglerad bebyggelse, men på 1870-talet stakades tomter och gator ut efter samma storlek som i intilliggande västra stadsdelen. Bebyggelsen i kv Bagaren, strax väster om Norrlands Dragonregemente, tillkom under perioden 1888–1914. Namnet fick kvarteret efter det bageri, som tillsammans med tillhörande bostadshus upptog en stor tomt i kvarterets nordvästra hörn."

Can you tell where the old bakery was? Now I am wondering if the word Bagaren next my great grandfather's name in the household examinations was not necessarily because he was a baker but because he lived in this part of Umeå.

Lief - Thanks for your detective work on the demise of Timmermannen.

2020-02-15, 19:46
Svar #130

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My guess is that the block was named Bagaren (the Baker) after an already existing bakery that must have been a big one as the two B/W photos on page 7 show. I wouldn't be surprised if your great grandfather worked there as a baker. With the early hours it must have been convenient living close by.

I've put a red frame around the bakery buildings in the attached pic.

2020-02-15, 19:49
Svar #131

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The Bakery was in the corner Ryttargatan and Dragongatan. What map function do you use? hitta.se give you the possibility to see property names. He was a Baker, possibly working at that Bakery.

2020-02-15, 20:30
Svar #132

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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So, you guys are making me think that Sven Jonasson Björklund lived at No. 103 Timmermannen (red) and worked at Bagaren (the bakery, green) at the time of the 1888-1893 household examination. You think that's right?

2020-02-15, 21:10
Svar #133

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Many things are strange. In Hfl for 1888-1893 there is Timmermannen, but I don't find Snickaren or Bageriet. Also before and after Timmermannen in Hfl are Elefanten and Hjorten and I don't find them on the 1899 map. And after 1894 I don't find any of these. Could Timmermannen be a larger area and 103 was actually the Bakery?

2020-02-16, 05:56
Svar #134

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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I think there's little doubt that the No. 103 refers to Timmermannen because if one looks at the index at the beginning of the 1888-1893 household examination book:

https://sok.riksarkivet.se/bildvisning/C0034468_00008#?c=&m=&s=&cv=7&xywh=-1553%2C-82%2C11265%2C5903

the name Timmermannen with its various numbers (in order) appears on the same pages indicated in the index.

Regarding the strange fact that the name Bagaren does not appear in the 1888-18893 index, this may provide a reason:

Kvarteret Bagaren
"Den del av Umeå som låg närmast väster om stadens rutnätsplan kallades på 1857 års karta Amerika. Här fanns då en oreglerad bebyggelse, men på 1870-talet stakades tomter och gator ut efter samma storlek som i intilliggande västra stadsdelen. Bebyggelsen i kv Bagaren, strax väster om Norrlands Dragonregemente, tillkom under perioden 1888–1914. Namnet fick kvarteret efter det bageri, som tillsammans med tillhörande bostadshus upptog en stor tomt i kvarterets nordvästra hörn."

My google translation of the above leaves some doubts as to what it actually says/means?

We are comparing historical notes, info from the 1888-1893 household examination, and family lore with an 1899 map.

2020-02-16, 06:08
Svar #135

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Wikipedia says that the name "Norland's Dragoon Regiment" was first used in 1892, so that certainly agrees with the info on the 1899 map. It appears that the name Bagaren was not used until sometime between 1893 (when it is missing from the household examination) and 1899 (when it appears on the map).

2020-02-16, 09:06
Svar #136

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I'm beginning to suspect a mismatch between the block names in the hfl and the 1899 map. One must remember that the 1899 map is a plan, with some new blocks and streets laid out. So maybe there once was another block Timmermannen after all.
As Leif has pointed out, Bagaren is not to be found in the hfl AI/15a. But Amerika is there, in AI/15b p 191 onwards. And as the brochure explains, Amerika was the old name for the area.
I'm afraid that we don't have evidence for connecting Don's ancestors to the bakery or finding their home on the map. One would probably have to roam Umeå's municipal archive to solve this.

The bakery was definitely in the block ''Bagaren'. The shape of the buildings in the photos correspond exactly with how they're drawed on the map.

The Norrlands Dragoon regiment was indeed set up in 1893, but didn't move to their then new barracks and buildings (shown on the map) until 1901.

I've tried to polish the translation a bit:

The part of Umeå that was located immediately west of the city's grid map was called 'America' on the 1857 map. Here there was an unregulated settlement, but starting the 1870s, plots and streets were fenced out to the same size as in the adjacent western district [i.e. the district to the east of 'America']. The buildings in the block Bagaren, just west of the Norrland Dragoon Regiment, was added during the period 1888-1914. The block was named after the bakery, which together with the associated residential building occupied a large plot in the block's northwest corner.

2020-02-16, 18:27
Svar #137

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KGs reference to America is in vol 15c p 191.
A theory: Timmermannen at that time was a larger, mostly unbuilt area and 103 was the actual Bakery and Sven Jonasson Björklund THE Baker that lived and worked there and later gave the new block the name. 103 had several owners, which might be because it was not a simple lodging but an enterprise. In Umeå stadsförsamling (AC) AI:14a (1877-1887) Bild 243 / sid 221 (AID: v139943.b243.s221, NAD: SE/HLA/1010220) 103 has previous owners and information I don't understand, is it possible to find other information somewhere else?

2020-02-16, 19:14
Svar #138

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Vol 15c of course, sorry about the typo.

Leif's theory seems plausible indeed - the records in AI/14a give the impression of a big bakery that may well correspond to the one in the brochure photos.

The new block names in the area - Bagaren, Timmermannen (the Carpenter), Skräddaren (the Tailor) and so on - appear in AIIa/2c, from 1899 onwards.

2020-02-16, 23:30
Svar #139

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Leif Lundkvist - I like your supposition that the three owners of No. 103 possibly suggested an establishment of some kind - such as a bakery. But it also seems reasonable that an apartment (curtain?) complex would have multiple owners.

The Umeå stadsförsamlings kyrkoarkiv, Husförhörslängder, SE/HLA/1010220/A I/14b (1877-1887), bildid: C0034466_00174, sida 518 shows "snickaren" for the first 4 tenants on the page.  Google says this is another word for "Timmermannen." Then, "Bagaren" is shown above the Björklund family. I always thought this meant that Sven Jonasson Björklundwas a baker. Maybe that is still true. But it seems like it might mean they lived on the Bagaren block as shown on the 1899 map?  But then why is snickaren on the same page? According to the 1899 map, snickaren was a block of it's own. I cannot access the original link but maybe the adjacent pages show that this page marked the border between the snickaren and bagaren blocks, although this seem unlikely to me? Therefore, was the profession of the first family on that page - carpentry?

2020-02-17, 00:07
Svar #140

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Snickaren Salomon Burman
Bagaren Sven Jonasson Björklund
These are their professional titles.
Mvh Anti

2020-02-17, 00:35
Svar #141

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Thank you Anti Poika.  After finally gaining access to the adjacent files, that seemed more obvious. I found snickaren, baker's alley?, hat makers, etc.

2020-02-17, 01:50
Svar #142

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https://sok.riksarkivet.se/bildvisning/C0057383_00280#?c=&m=&s=&cv=279&xywh=262%2C495%2C3368%2C1957

On the above page, can anyone please interpret the entries in the column labeled flytarr till? I assume the cross means death?

Do you think it means anything that the birthdate and birthplace of Sven born 1851 were not indicated?

2020-02-17, 02:00
Svar #143

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Matttis moved to No. 36 in 1850. The others died in 1847 and 1849.

The omitted date for Sven may indicate he was not born in this parish. You may be able to check this.
Mvh Anti

2020-02-17, 02:07
Svar #144

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Thank you. I think Sven was born in Hällaryd but we never determined exactly where the church was?

Hällaryd kyrkoarkiv, Födelse- och dopböcker, SE/LLA/13167/C I/7 (1845-1861), bildid: C0057405_00064, sida 55.

2020-02-17, 02:12
Svar #145

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Ok, he was born on January 8, 1851, in Björkenäs.
Mvh Anti

2020-02-17, 02:20
Svar #146

Utloggad Leif Lundkvist

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Going forward is good! In Umeå stadsförsamling (AC) AIIa:2c (1902-1908) Bild 2150 / sid 881 (AID: v139960.b2150.s881, NAD: SE/HLA/1010220) up to page 883 is Bagaren no 4, which is the Bakery on the 1899 map. The owner is Falkman & Co, i.e. it is actually an enterprise and the owners (family) is living there. Several Bakery Workers are also living there. They are said to come from the previous volume page 657-660 and several of the persons are found in both locations, but in the old book the name of the property is Amerika no 20, thus we know that is the old name of the Bakery property. Next step backwards is G.B. 2/560 (Old Book no 2 page 560). That is Umeå stadsförsamling (AC) AI:16b (1894-1898) Bild 232 / sid 560 (AID: v139950.b232.s560, NAD: SE/HLA/1010220) and it is clear that it is the Bakery.

Unfortunately(?!) Björklund and his family moved to Amerika in 1893, but on Umeå stadsförsamling (AC) AI:15b (1888-1893) Bild 135 / sid 125 (AID: v139946.b135.s125, NAD: SE/HLA/1010220) (the page before Björklunds) is Anna Ulrika Levander in Timmermannen 102b, who is moved to Umeå stadsförsamling (AC) AI:16b (1894-1898) Bild 331 / sid 659 (AID: v139950.b331.s659, NAD: SE/HLA/1010220) which is in Haga, an area in north Umeå. Other persons in Timmermannen are also found in Haga, thus it seems that the old Timmermannen was a block in the new Haga. Next Levander is in Umeå stadsförsamling (AC) AIIa:1c (1899-1902) Bild 1250 / sid 787 (AID: v139955.b1250.s787, NAD: SE/HLA/1010220), Haga no 10. Can this be verified in another way?

Thus it seems that Björklund did not live that close to the Bakery, but he could still work there, but it was possible that Umeå had more than one Bakery.

2020-02-17, 05:00
Svar #147

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Good work Leif but I'm more confused now than ever.

Can anyone find this place Lyckö on a map?

https://sok.riksarkivet.se/bildvisning/C0057384_00257#?c=&m=&s=&cv=256&xywh=479%2C762%2C1200%2C706


2020-02-17, 10:12
Svar #148

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Lyckön is a small island in Södra Öllesjön. Don't think there have been any houses there, though. There's a village Lycke just south of the lake. My guess is that Lyckö is an older spelling of that village.

2020-02-17, 20:20
Svar #149

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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I was excited to see the island Lyckö in the lake on one of your maps because I've seen the name in old household examinations too and wondered about it.  It even had No. 36 assigned to it in Hällaryd at one time.

https://sok.riksarkivet.se/bildvisning/C0057380_00007#?c=&m=&s=&cv=6&xywh=1035%2C1670%2C5991%2C3482

2020-02-17, 20:35
Svar #150

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As you can see, spelling varies: on pages 200-201, it's No. 36 Lycke. So I do believe that we are dealing with Lycke on the mainland, which is also the spelling one finds on both earlier and later maps.

P.S. Here's a nice map over Blekinge: a copy from 1735 of a map from 1684:
https://historiskakartor.lantmateriet.se/historiskakartor/show.html?showmap=true&mapTypeSelected=true&mapType=lh&archive=LMS&nbOfImages=1&sd_base=lms2&sd_ktun=4c4d535f493138

2020-02-18, 00:17
Svar #151

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Are you only interested in where you can find the village of Lycke, or do you also want to know the exact location of the farm on page 241 in Hällaryd AI:10 (1852-1859)?
Because if the latter is the case I do believe that I can help you with that.

2020-02-18, 01:58
Svar #152

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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I can't see that map KG.  I thought that Hellaryd was the same as Hällaryd, Pehrsgärde was the same as Pärsgärde and Lyckö was the same as Lycke?

Finn Fries - It sounds like you're an expert.  I'm trying to locate these places:

Farms in Hällaryd, Blekinge:

Sven Jonasson at No. 42 Pehrsgärde, 1841-46.

Mattes Jonasson at No. 36 Lyckö, 1852-59.

Jonas Svensson at No. 40 Björkenas, 1804-1855; 1881-1883.

Jonas Svensson at No. 3 Binga, 1855-1881.

Bakery and home in Västerbotten:

Sven Jonasson Björklund, baker, at No. 103 Timmermannen, Umeå, 1877-1893.

Kind of you to offer to help.  I know I may be asking too much but...just ignore any illegitimate requests.

2020-02-18, 06:33
Svar #153

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Does anyone recognize the name of the place from where Jonas Svensson moved (on line 15)?

https://sok.riksarkivet.se/bildvisning/C0057389_00046#?c=&m=&s=&cv=45&xywh=182%2C3483%2C2417%2C1405

2020-02-18, 06:50
Svar #154

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Hjortsberga parish, Blekinge

2020-02-18, 07:16
Svar #155

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Thank you Anti Poika. 

Do you know if the the two relocation certificates mentioned are available somewhere?

2020-02-18, 07:28
Svar #156

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Hjortsberga parish, Blekinge?  The Google Maps page for this place shows pictures of the bell tower that I thought was at the Edestad church in Edestad? Unless it's a different bell tower?

2020-02-18, 07:59
Svar #157

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Nevermind - I found the certificates.

2020-02-18, 09:09
Svar #158

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I think this document might show the 1836 signature of my great great grandfather Jonas Svensson (1804-1888) from Björkenäs. Can anyone give me an idea about what was happening?

2020-02-18, 10:27
Svar #159

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It's a request that the official land surveyor should properly fence out the borders between tenants and landowners in Björkenäs, Hällaryd.
The bottom left paragraph says: "Written by request by Erik(?) Pehrsson, Långehall". It might be your ancestors signature, but it might also be Pehrsson's handwriting. I'm inclined opting for the latter, since it doesn't differ from the rest of the text. Not everyone wrote their signatures back in the 1830's, many still used their house mark. And if one needed to send an official request it was common to ask for help from someone more versed in writing, maybe the sexton or the 'nämndeman' (juryman).

2020-02-18, 19:32
Svar #160

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Thanks KG. Based on what I know about the family, their farming profession, their high mortality rate, and the era - before schooling was a real priority, I'm inclined to agree with, especially now that you astutely point out the similarity in writing of the paragraph and signature. It seems unlikely to me that Jonas Svensson could have written such a paragraph. On the other hand, he was a church warden, so perhaps that indicates some education?

2020-02-18, 19:57
Svar #161

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Perhaps there's a hint about Jonas Svensson's education here:

https://sok.riksarkivet.se/bildvisning/C0057089_00017#?c=&m=&s=&cv=16&xywh=222%2C1593%2C1935%2C1125

It appears there's a mentions of a skola and a 12-year-old conveyance?

2020-02-18, 20:38
Svar #162

Utloggad Leif Lundkvist

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Hm. The words "transport pag. 12" say that he is moved to page 12 and you find him there. And the title Skl (or is it Skb?) what is it short for, Skollärare? = Teacher?

2020-02-18, 20:39
Svar #163

Utloggad KG Hammarlund

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"Skb" has nothing to do with "skola". It means "skattebonde" - he was thus a landowner, paying land value tax or "ground tax".
"Transport pag. 12" - he is moved to page 12 in the hfl.
The first columns on the right hand page says that he could read fairly well and knew the important parts of Martin Luther's catechesis by heart. That was what was deemed important knowledge back then.
He might well have known how to write but he hardly wrote that formal request on his own. He might of course have signed it.

2020-02-18, 20:54
Svar #164

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Thanks Leif for correcting my attempts to read Swedish.

Oh, "skattebonde!" Thank you KG. Are you sure that doesn't mean "scatterbrain?" That might explain one's inability to sign his name?

Seriously, I really liked the idea that they were teachers. The same notation can be found by his son Johan's name here:

https://sok.riksarkivet.se/bildvisning/C0057090_00021

But you're saying there's no way, right?

Wish I could read the stuff in the right hand column.

2020-02-18, 21:11
Svar #165

Utloggad KG Hammarlund

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Sorry, no way.
You can find a Skb on Binga 4, Binga 5 and so on...
There were no proper teachers on the countryside until after the introduction of the Folkskola 1842 and even then it took years, even decades, until each parish had a teacher with a formal education.
Even if everyone should know how to read this was first and foremost the parents' responsibility to learn their children. If they couldn't, the vicar or the sexton or maybe a disabled ex-soldier could act as a teacher.

2020-02-18, 21:14
Svar #166

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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OK, I really appreciate you guys sharing your knowledge about these things.  Otherwise, I am left to make stuff up, which I am quite good at.

Can you please provide a link for Jonas on page 12?  I can't find him on the page 12 I am looking at?

2020-02-18, 21:18
Svar #167

Utloggad KG Hammarlund

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2020-02-18, 21:20
Svar #168

Utloggad Leif Lundkvist

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Skattebonde is of course right. If you had not talked about school, I had never guessed on skollärare.

2020-02-19, 03:56
Svar #169

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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I take full blame for leading you in the wrong direction Leif.  I thought it said Skl but it's Skb.  "Skola" was just another one of my many made-up guesses.

Can someone please explain the second entry for 1869 here to me:

https://sok.riksarkivet.se/bildvisning/C0057095_00024#?c=&m=&s=&cv=23&xywh=4053%2C4245%2C4084%2C2436

Don

2020-02-19, 09:02
Svar #170

Utloggad KG Hammarlund

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On April 14 the farm hand (dräng) Sven Jonasson moves from Binga to Köpenhamn (= Copenhagen, Denmark).

2020-02-19, 10:21
Svar #171

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Thanks KG. I'm pretty sure that Jonas Svensson's first son Sven Jonasson born in 1828 died in 1847, so I'm thinking this might be my great grandfather, Jonas' second son Sven Jonasson (Björklund) born in 1851. Any idea why a Blekinge farm boy would go to Copenhagen? Is that where he could catch a ride to Skellefteå?

2020-02-19, 11:45
Svar #172

Utloggad KG Hammarlund

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Moving from south Sweden to Denmark was quite common during the second half of the 19th century. Moving from Copenhagen to Skellefteå was probably much more unusual.

2020-02-19, 20:18
Svar #173

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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I suspect Sven just wanted to get away from Binga - anywhere. He probably didn't intend on going to Skellefteå initially, but he ended up there. Curious?

Is there a site like this one with Danish records?

2020-02-19, 20:28
Svar #174

Utloggad Anti Poika

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Selvfølgelig, of course, Don.
Here is a place where you can learn Danish  ;) - Danske Slægtsforskere
and The Danish National Archives where you are able to find records.
Mvh Anti

2020-02-19, 21:22
Svar #175

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Dear Anti Poika,

I'm not sure I want to delve into all that at the moment but I certainly do appreciate the links. It's a little overwhelming, to be honest - lägga lök på laxen?

Does anyone know anything about this Swedish sabbath book? Apparently, Jonas Svensson gave an old sabbath book from the 1700s to his granddaughter, my great aunt. Did people/families keep these books?

2020-02-20, 00:36
Svar #176

Utloggad Anti Poika

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Dear Don Kaiser,
Thank you for sharing this family history. I have never heard about 'Misanders Gudi helgade Sabbaths-Ro', bestående uti Gudeliga Betraktelser öfwer alla Sön- och Högtidsdagars Evangelier, hela året igenom. I suppose it was nice to read something in their native language, the language you now are studying.  :)
Mvh Anti

2020-02-20, 01:23
Svar #177

Utloggad Finn Fries

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I am not an expert, but as we have a summer house in Lycke I happen to know a little about the surroundings.
If you follow the farm where Mattis Jonasson lived in the Household examination rolls you can see that it is taken over by Hällaryd parish in the late 19:th century and turned into a home for the poor and retired (fattiggård).
On the map from 1915 that you have discussed earlier in this thread you can find the "Fattiggård" in the middle of Lycke.
This farm that disappeared in the middle of the last century was actually the last one in the original location of the village.
You have already discussed the map of Björkenäs and I do believe that Jonas Svensson and his father lived in the original village which I think is easiest to see on the map from 1811.
If Jonas moved from the farm about 1855 it is possible that the partitioning of Björkenäs in 1854 has something to do with it.
I saw your discussion about trees and Björkenäs actually has an old, big and beautiful ash tree that must have been growing there already when Jonas Svensson lived there.

2020-02-20, 02:10
Svar #178

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Anti Poika,

I'm glad you liked that history tidbit but very surprised you don't know about this because after all, it is Swedish stuff. It sounds as if the sabbath book was used as a family bible.  But I never heard of such a book either. Maybe it was just a bible? Maybe the book had something to do with Jonas Svensson's duty as a church warden? Did Swedish families have bibles or books in which they recorded family births, etc.?

My father who wasn't Swedish, told me that someone showed him his name in the family bible when he was a little boy visiting at his grandfather's house. Unfortunately, nobody knows where this family bible is today.

I wonder how Sven Jonasson got from No. 3 Binga to Copenhagen in 1869; by foot, horse, carriage, boat, train? I suppose there was a ferry.

2020-02-20, 02:13
Svar #179

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Wow - Finn Fries - Thank you for this information.  I have a lot of homework to do with the maps, etc. before I can understand all this but I really appreciate your help.  Say, where is Lycke on google maps?  I can only see a place on the west coast.  Your summer home isn't on the island in the lake is it?

Best regards,

Don

2020-02-20, 05:52
Svar #180

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Any ideas about how to find people who livde in Åryd around 1868 in the household examinations for Hällaryd? Does Åryd have a No. associated with it?

2020-02-20, 13:28
Svar #181

Utloggad Anti Poika

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Mvh Anti

2020-02-20, 16:48
Svar #182

Utloggad KG Hammarlund

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'Misanders Gudi helgade Sabbaths-Ro' was a postil (a postilla in Swedish), a collection of sermons. If you couldn't make it to the church you could read a sermoon för that Sunday at home. They were common, and there were a lot of them, edited by men of the clergy. The one edited by Johann Arndt might have been the most widespread, but Misanders..., edited by Johann Samuel Adami, was also common - there are 16 editions in Swedish translation published between 1736 and 1820.

2020-02-20, 21:12
Svar #183

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Aha! So Åryd was a Parish, separate from Hällaryd.


Ibland är det svårt att se skogen genom björkträden.

2020-02-20, 21:23
Svar #184

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Thank you KG. That's very interesting about the postil. So, Jonas Svensson gave his granddaughter, his former wife's namesake (Elna), a book of sermons for spiritual edification that contained some family lore as well. It wasn't a bible. I suppose it was called a sabbath book because it was used on the sabbath when you couldn't get to church. Great stuff!

2020-02-20, 21:37
Svar #185

Utloggad KG Hammarlund

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Thank you, Don, for sharing the newspaper cutting!
About birch trees (Björklund is, as you surely know, literally 'birch grove'): Umeå is often called 'the town of the birch trees'. The birch trees were originally planted as fire protection - if the streets were lined with trees with fresh foilage, it would be harder for the fire to spread. They also helped containing the fire of 1888 or the whole town may have disappeared. Today there are over 2,000 birch trees in the city centre.

2020-02-20, 22:33
Svar #186

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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2020-02-20, 22:55
Svar #187

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Can anybody make out the causes of death from these records marked in red:

2020-02-20, 23:11
Svar #188

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Dear Finn Fries,

I can see where Lycke is and the fattiggård on the map (see attachment) but I fail to see how you have determined that this place was once the farm of Mattis Jonasson?

Best,

Don

2020-02-20, 23:45
Svar #189

Utloggad Anti Poika

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Can anybody make out the causes of death from these records marked in red:

1.
Nerffeber, nervfeber
Nerffeber

   febris nervosa
   tyfoidfeber, tyfus; förr även i vidsträcktare användning, om sådana febersjukdomar överhuvudtaget vari nervsystemet ansågs vara angripet.
https://svenska.se/tre/?sok=nervfeber&pz=2

Feber
   fever

2.
tärande sjukdom
   a weakening or strenuous disease which finally ends in death

3.
Slagflus eller slaganfall
   apoplexy
Mvh Anti

2020-02-21, 04:13
Svar #190

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Dear Anti Poika,

Thanks for the translations. It's very sad for me to see the deaths of 3 relatives on the same page of the church books but imagine the sadness felt by their parents and family.

I'm glad I asked because I thought Petter and Sven got "smelt fever."

I suspect that the causes of most deaths back then on the farms of Blekinge were poorly understood.

Thanks!

2020-02-21, 06:03
Svar #191

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Anti Poika,

I found one Danish document that could be my great grandfather Sven Jonasson but I cannot understand what this document is. It looks like people being read out of the parish but I don't know. Can you please help me understand what it says about Sven Jonasson who is listed as number 12 in 1873?

Don


2020-02-22, 07:18
Svar #192

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Found this inside one of the church books.

2020-02-23, 04:32
Svar #193

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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If the Danish document says something bad about my great grandfather, I can take it?

2020-02-23, 05:09
Svar #194

Utloggad Anti Poika

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The main thing about it is the move to Kjöpenhavn, Copenhagen. :)
Mvh Anti

2020-02-23, 05:45
Svar #195

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Can anyone translate this please? I think it's Danish?


2020-02-23, 09:38
Svar #196

Utloggad Kalle Birgersson

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It's a name. I don't know exactly what they mean with "handtering" in this case, even though it translates to "handling". It could be the officer that handled this relocation, but there seem to be too many names, there shouldn't be so many officers.

2020-02-23, 22:58
Svar #197

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Dear Kalle Birgersson,

Thank you. It sort of makes sense to me that "Handling" could be weakly interpreted as "profession." Such an interpretation might also explain the numerous different entries in that column, but I can't really read any of them so I don't know if they are actually names or professions. Sven Jonasson was a baker later in life and I've been trying to determine where this old Blekinge farm hand learned the baking trade. That's why I was interested in the word which looks like "Baiker" to me. But Baiker doesn't seem to mean baker?  Maybe all these people who seem to be primarily young lads from Sweden were apprentices and the Handlings were their masters? Maybe the Danish church ran a program to help these poor Swedish immigrants fit into Copenhagen society?

2020-02-23, 23:56
Svar #198

Utloggad Anti Poika

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Haandtering has to have something to do with profession or employment, and all the names in the columns could be the names of the employers. As your source is not known it is hard to check other pages in the record.
My guess:
han tjen(er) h(os) Baiker/Backer
he works for Baiker
Mvh Anti

2020-02-24, 00:26
Svar #199

Utloggad Finn Fries

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This is how it is possible to see that Mattis Jonassons farm is the same as the "Fattiggård".

Mattis Jonasson was succeded by Ola Olsson born 1832 in Hoby.
Hällaryds kyrkoarkiv, Husförhörslängder, SE/LLA/13167/A I/10 (1852-1859), bildid: C0057384_00257, sida 241

Ola Olsson, b 1832 Hoby, dead 1863 (owner Åke Bondesson).
Hällaryds kyrkoarkiv, Husförhörslängder, SE/LLA/13167/A I/12 (1861-1865), bildid: C0057386_00332, sida 328

New farmer Ola Jonsson b 1844 Åryd replaced 1868 by Ola Olsson b 1846 Åryd (owner Åke Bondesson).
Hällaryds kyrkoarkiv, Husförhörslängder, SE/LLA/13167/A I/13 (1866-1870), bildid: C0057387_00347, sida 339

Ola Olsson b 1846 Åryd (owner Peter Forsberg).
Hällaryds kyrkoarkiv, Husförhörslängder, SE/LLA/13167/A I/14 (1871-1876), bildid: C0057388_00351, sida 343

Johan Olsson b 1852 Ysane (owner Peter Forsberg).
Hällaryds kyrkoarkiv, Husförhörslängder, SE/LLA/13167/A I/15 (1877-1884), bildid: C0057389_00364, sida 356

Johan Olsson b 1852 Ysane new owner Hällaryd församling (parish), turned into "Fattiggård".
Hällaryds kyrkoarkiv, Husförhörslängder, SE/LLA/13167/A I/19 (1890-1899), bildid: C0057393_00293, sida 281

This photo of the farm is probably from before 1932 when the closest barn burned down.

2020-02-24, 07:39
Svar #200

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Many thanks Anti Poika.  The adjacent pages are similar. Here is a summary of the record:

Denmark, Church Records, 1812-1918
Name: Sven Jonasson
Gender: Mandlig (Male)
Departure Age:   21
Event Type: Afgang (take off)
Birth Date: abt 1852
Residence Place: Vallensbæk Sogn, København
Departure Date:   1873
Departure Place: Danmark (Denmark)

2020-02-24, 22:04
Svar #201

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Dear Finn Fries,

I cannot thank you enough for the photo of Fattiggård (It certainly doesn't look so poor to me) and your tracing of the Olsson family farm to this place. 

Mattis Jonasson (1832-1852) married Martha Olasdotter (1833-1894) in 1851 and their son Sven Mattisson (Mattsson) was born on 4 Apr 1852.

Hällaryds kyrkoarkiv, Födelse- och dopböcker, SE/LLA/13167/C I/7 (1845-1861), bildid: C0057405_00076, sida 66.

I am in a bind because it appears that Sven's birthday got changed to 4 Jan 1852 sometime between his birth and the subsequent household examinations. This makes me wonder if he ever knew when his real birthday actually was. I also wonder if maybe his mother changed it for some personal reason. Note that Sven's father died 28 Nov 1852. This suggests that Mattis Jonasson was indeed the father of Sven because he was alive 9 months before Sven's birth. But if Sven's birthday becomes 4 Jan 1852, this means that Mattis could not be Sven's father because he was not alive 9 months before Sven's birth. Assuming Martha changed Sven's birthday (the new date appears even before she remarried), I'm thinking that for some reason Martha didn't want anyone to know that Mattis Jonasson was the father of her first child Sven Mattisson. But this really doesn't make sense because Sven's name always appears as Sven Mattisson, which literally means he was Mattis's son? Does anyone have any ideas about this curious mystery?

Finn Fries - Forgive me, but I still can't see how Martha Olasdotter and Mattis Jonasson necessarily farmed the same place in No. 36 Lycke that Martha's subsequent Olsson in-laws did and that eventually became Fattiggård. Maybe you can deduce this by the ordering of families in the household examinations?

Best regards,

Don

2020-02-25, 00:20
Svar #202

Utloggad Finn Fries

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The idea is that the identity of the farm is verified with this long chain where the farmers or owners are the same before and after every step.
Besides that I have already, because of my own interest in the history of Lycke, identified the changes in location, size and owners of all the farms in the village during the 19'th century using old maps, taxation rolls, household examination rolls and documents from the distribution reforms.
However, it is probably a little too complicated to go into the details here. So I think that the previous published chain of farmers and owners should be sufficient.
I suppose that Mattis dying after the birth of his son can't be a problem.
Anyway, changes of dates are quite common due to mistakes made by the priests, and people could harldy make any changes themselves.

2020-02-25, 04:00
Svar #203

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Dear Finn Fries,

Aha! You are an expert! Just as I thought! If you have maps, tax records, etc., this is very interesting. I certainly appreciate everything you've shared with me to help me better understand the place where poor Mattis Jonasson farmed during his brief life.

Regarding Sven's birthday, there's little doubt about his birth and baptism on 4 and 10 Apr 1852. The next available record seems to be the 1852-1859 household examination:

Hällaryds kyrkoarkiv, Husförhörslängder, SE/LLA/13167/A I/10 (1852-1859), bildid: C0057384_00257, sida 241.

Here, it appears that the month was re-entered. It's hard to be certain but it seems a "4" was entered first, then it was made to look like a "1."

All subsequent records show his birthday as 4 Jan 1852.  This is very curious to me. I don't think it was a mistake but a deliberate change. 

I love the photo. Is this where your summer home his?

2020-02-25, 17:09
Svar #204

Utloggad Finn Fries

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I should add that the photo is from the book "Hällaryds socken" about local history produced by Hällaryd-Åryds PRO (the local pensioner's association).
It was printed in 1997 and probably not available anymore.

2020-02-26, 04:00
Svar #205

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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OK Thanks Finn.  Please feel free to post any other photos, maps, etc. that you think might be of interest.

2020-02-27, 20:55
Svar #206

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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The big fire in Umeå was in 1888, June 25, when most of the wooden town with it's narrow streets was destroyed. Maria Johanna emigrated a few days later. After the reconstruction there were broader streets and avenues with a lot of birches to prevent fires to spread. That's why Umeå is called "City of birches".
https://sv.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stadsbranden_i_Ume%C3%A5

The guy Sjöström on line 23 (page 126 in AI:15b) has probably nothing to do with your family. He just lived in the same place. But on line 17 there is a Miss Lovisa Karolina Rönnlund.

Retrospectively, now that you guys have taught me some Umeå history, do you think it would be possible to determine if the guy Sjöström on line 23 was a member of the ungliga Norrlands Dragonregemente?

2020-03-05, 19:27
Svar #207

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Google doesn't know Gårdsman. Can anyone pleaase tell me what it means?

Context: Svensson, Jonas, b. 1804 in Hällaryd Blekinge län, Gårdsman

2020-03-05, 19:31
Svar #208

Utloggad Kalle Birgersson

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Normally an older, retired farmer living in his own little house somewhere on the farm

2020-03-05, 19:59
Svar #209

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Thank you Kalle Birgersson.

2020-03-05, 20:09
Svar #210

Utloggad KG Hammarlund

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In what was once Danish provinces, gårdman might also mean owner/tenant (Danish = gårdmand), although this usage is probably less common. The person's age, place in the family, and so on might help to decide what best fits the particular case.

2020-03-05, 22:33
Svar #211

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Thank you KG. 

Even though it gve me no translation, Google asked if I wanted to translate from Danish rather than Swedish.  Owner or tenant sounds good. We also have in these old Danish provinces places like Pehrsgärde, presumably where Pehr owned or rented land that he watched over.

2020-03-12, 08:00
Svar #212

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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On 31 Oct 1860, farm-hand Karl Jonasson traveled from Binga No. 3 to Karlskrona No. 29.

https://sok.riksarkivet.se/bildvisning/C0057341_00159

https://sok.riksarkivet.se/bildvisning/C0057959_00260

Then, on 20 Feb 1864 he traveled from Karlskrona to Copenhagen as a journeyman baker.

https://sok.riksarkivet.se/bildvisning/C0057905_00070

Is it reasonable that Karl spent the whole 3 1/2 years as an apprentice learning to become a journeyman baker?

Also, if anyone would be so kind to translate the moving information here:

https://sok.riksarkivet.se/bildvisning/C0057959_00260

I can decipher some of it but it seems there is also some very interesting info there that I do not understand.

Don




2020-03-12, 10:12
Svar #213

Utloggad Kalle Birgersson

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A few words are hidden in the binding of the book, but the rest read like this:
Citera
Bondesonen Carl Jonasson, född i Hellaryd den 12 may 1843 (hundrafyrtiotre), föräld. Hemmansegaren Jonas Svensson och h. Elna Pehrsd. kom 1855 från Hellaryd, flyttar nu till Carlskrona, läser innantill försvarligt, utantill Luth. Cath. för?ligt och förstår salighetsläran enkelt, bevistat förhören stan? och begått Herrans hel. nattv. sednast d. 6 april d.å., är väl?ydad och arbetsför, fri från äktenskapsförbindelse såsom u.ä. och ?.p., vaccinerad och för innevarande år i mantal uppförd på No. 3 Binga, attesteras Hjortsberga, som ofvan G. Lindström
Farmers son Carl Jonasson born in Hellaryd may 12 1843 (hundredfortythree) parents home owner Jonas Svensson and wife Elna Persdotter, came 1855 from Helleryd, now moves to Karlskrona, read ok, *hard to translate religious skills here* ...able to work, free from marriage connections, like (out of wedlock children?), vaccinated, this year in tax records belonging to no. 3 Binga, attested in Hjortsberga, like above G. Lindström.

2020-03-12, 23:22
Svar #214

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Kalle - Your transcription into modern Swedish is great because it allows a regular google translation:

The farmer's son Carl Jonasson, born in Hellaryd on May 12, 1843 (one hundred and thirty-three), a parent. Home owner Jonas Svensson and h. Elna Pehrsd. arrived in 1855 from Hellaryd, now moves to Carlskrona, reads inwardly, with the exception of Luth. Cath. for and understand the doctrine of salvation easily, proved the interrogation of the town? and committed the Lord's whole. nattv. since April 6th, is well-groomed and working, free of marital affiliation, such as u.ä. and? .p., vaccinated and for the current year in numbers listed on No. 3 Binga, is certified Hjortsberga, as by G. Lindström

The "Luth. Cath."part is interesting. It seems to indicate something important at the time, the meaning of which I have no idea.

I assume the vaccination was against small pox.

2020-03-12, 23:53
Svar #215

Utloggad Kalle Birgersson

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The "Luth. Cath."part is interesting. It seems to indicate something important at the time, the meaning of which I have no idea.
Martin Luther's Catechism, bible stuff.

2020-03-13, 00:15
Svar #216

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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I should have known this because #136 above mentions "Martin Luther's catechism." Wikipedia says:

Luther's Small Catechism was written by Martin Luther and published in 1529 for the training of children. It reviews the:

1. Ten Commandments
2. Apostles' Creed
3. Lord's Prayer
4. Sacrament of Holy Baptism
5. Office of the Keys and Confession
6. Sacrament of the Eucharist.

It was mandatory for confirmands in the Church of Sweden until the 1960s.

I can't find Carl Svensson Bjorklund in Karlskrona from 1860-1864. Any ideas?

2020-03-13, 00:31
Svar #217

Utloggad Kalle Birgersson

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I can't find Carl Svensson Bjorklund in Karlskrona from 1860-1864. Any ideas?
Right here, line 14:

https://sok.riksarkivet.se/bildvisning/C0057877_00125#?c=&m=&s=&cv=124&xywh=-1595%2C1989%2C6277%2C2975

Moves away again in 1864, I'm not sure but it could be Köpenhamn/Copenhagen? Will probably be easier to read in the movements book.

2020-03-13, 03:36
Svar #218

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Thanks! How did you find that?

I was looking in the indices and also for Karlskrona No. 29 but couldn't find either.

Can you read Line #1?  It looks like it might say something about a baker?

2020-03-13, 09:54
Svar #219

Utloggad Kalle Birgersson

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I cheated and used a search tool i arkiv digital, so it was easy.

Johan Henrik Sjölander, bagarmäst., master-baker, I suppose

2020-03-13, 23:09
Svar #220

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Oh, this is great. If the head of the household on line 1 was Johan Henrik Sjölander, bagarmäst (master-baker), then I have to assume that Johan Henrik Sjölander was the same master baker to whom Carl was apprenticed.

There is a date next to Carl's name on line 14. Do you know what it means? Could this have something to do with his apprenticeship or perhaps when he became "Bjorklund?" Note that he arrived in Karlskrona in 1860 as Carl Jonasson and he left Karlskrona for in 1864 as Carl Jonasson Bjorklund.

2020-03-13, 23:25
Svar #221

Utloggad Kalle Birgersson

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Maybe that is when he took his new last name, I don't know. I don't know much about the craftsmen in the citys, I have none of that in my own family.

2020-03-14, 02:58
Svar #222

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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That would be very interesting if Carl Jonasson first started using the name Björklund on 6 Nov 1863. He may have been the first person in the family to use that name - presumably after Björkenas?  Do the scribbles before and after Björklund mean anything to you on line 14?

2020-03-14, 03:31
Svar #223

Utloggad Leif Lundkvist

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I think 6/11 is the date when he told the priest that now my name is Björklund. He had probably used the name for some time. Anyone could take such a name, most soldiers had such a name, it was common among craftsmen but was also used by a few farmers and farmhands. Only he himself knows why he took that name, but if he was from Björkenäs that is a good guess. The word after Björklund is fr = från = from, I'm not sure about the words before, "kallar sig" or "kallar sej" (named himself) are probable but it don't exactly look like that.

2020-03-14, 04:04
Svar #224

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Aha! Leif! Good to hear from you. So, it says that he called himself Björklund from 6 Nov 1863. That is so great. And it's not a guess about being derived from Björkenas. The attached article actually says so.

Carl's older brother John Jonasson was fighting for the Union Army in the American Civil War around the same time. I forgot that he used the surname Buckman, an Americanization of Björklund, so Carl wasn't the first to use the name.

When my great grandfather moved from Binga No. 3 to Copenhagen in 1869, he was known as Sven Jonasson.  I haven't been able to find him arriving back in Sweden from Copenhagen but he pops up again in the 1871-1880 census as Sven Jonasson Björklund in Skellefteå.

2020-03-14, 21:16
Svar #225

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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And thank you Kalle Birgersson! You may not have any of that craftsman stuff in your family but you certainly have a helpful hand nonetheless. I am so grateful for all your help and especially the lovely 1851 map of Björkenas. Now if I can only determine what that document is all about.

2020-03-15, 22:31
Svar #226

Utloggad Tony Andersson

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If it is document that you posted 2020-02-21, 06:03 it a list of people traveling out of a parish in Denmark. Number 12 1873 Sven Jonasson is 21.5 years old He is a ? Baker and he's going to Copenhagen. I believe he's in training to be a baker.

//Tony

2020-03-16, 03:56
Svar #227

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Dear Tony Andersson,

Thank you for the translation.

Name: Sven Jonasson
Gender: Mandlig (Male)
Departure Age:   21
Event Type: Afgang
Birth Date: abt 1852
Residence Place: Vallensbæk Sogn, København
Departure Date:   1873
Departure Place: Danmark (Denmark)

I believe at one time I thought the document said that Sven Jonasson was a "journeyman" baker but I'm not sure?  Do you think the document says he was leaving Vallensbæk Sogn for Copenhagen proper or was he leaving Vallensbæk Sogn, Copenhagen for some unknown place?

As you can see here:

https://sok.riksarkivet.se/bildvisning/C0024516_00054

Sven left Binga No. 3, Edestad Parish as a farm laborer on 14 Apr 1869 for Copenhagen presumably to learn the baking trade. I believe that by 1873, he would have been a journeyman baker? I happen to know that his older brother Carl Jonasson left Binga No. 3 for Karlskrona in 1860 and when he left Karlskrona in 1864, he was a journeyman baker. I don't know about such things but 3-4 years seems like a reasonable amount of time to become a journeyman baker?

The document I was referring to most recently is the one associated with this wonderful map of Björkenas provided by Kalle Birgersson:

https://historiskakartor.lantmateriet.se/historiskakartor/show.html?showmap=true&archive=REG&nbOfImages=32&sd_base=lm10&sd_ktun=000493ib&mdat=20170619155428928572

Thanks again!

Don

2020-03-16, 04:31
Svar #228

Utloggad Tony Andersson

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Sounds like he should be a journeyman baker then. My understanding is that he leaves sogn(parish) he is in for a trip to Kjöbenhavn(Copenhagen).

The 1851 map is a shifting. Shiftings were done all over at least southern sweden. A shifting meant that farmers owned many small plots of land was shifted so they got land that was connected.


2020-03-16, 05:01
Svar #229

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Thank you. Very interesting.  The map shows at least three separate properties for Jonas Svensson.  I assume in the shifting he gave those up for one piece of land.  Does it say where his new land was? could it have been Binga No. 3 in  Edestad Parish?

2020-03-16, 09:21
Svar #230

Utloggad KG Hammarlund

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Hi Don,
if you're interested in the Swedish "Skifte" or enclosure legislation that had fundamental impact on the Swedish agricultural landscape I could send you an old article that explains it in depth.
Send me a PM with your email address.

2020-04-02, 23:22
Svar #231

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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I am not an expert, but as we have a summer house in Lycke I happen to know a little about the surroundings.
If you follow the farm where Mattis Jonasson lived in the Household examination rolls you can see that it is taken over by Hällaryd parish in the late 19:th century and turned into a home for the poor and retired (fattiggård).
On the map from 1915 that you have discussed earlier in this thread you can find the "Fattiggård" in the middle of Lycke.
This farm that disappeared in the middle of the last century was actually the last one in the original location of the village.
You have already discussed the map of Björkenäs and I do believe that Jonas Svensson and his father lived in the original village which I think is easiest to see on the map from 1811.
If Jonas moved from the farm about 1855 it is possible that the partitioning of Björkenäs in 1854 has something to do with it.
I saw your discussion about trees and Björkenäs actually has an old, big and beautiful ash tree that must have been growing there already when Jonas Svensson lived there.

2020-04-03, 00:01
Svar #232

Utloggad Finn Fries

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I can see that you have used the colouring function in MyHeritage, and I do love that not only the junipers but also some of the other trees and bushes have turned green in the middle of the winter.

2020-04-03, 00:03
Svar #233

Utloggad Don Kaiser

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Yes- and I forgot to mention that in America we say "don't eat the yellow snow."

 

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