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Särskilda ämnen & övrigt => Archive - Swedish language => _Archives => Discussions in English => Diary entries => Ämnet startat av: Charles LaVine skrivet 2005-11-01, 01:52
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To All;
Two questions:
1. Roos has copied verbatim in his diary a letter he has written to a neighbor in Vasa, Minnesota who had promised to look out for the wellbeing of his family while he was in the Union Army. He closes the copy with the phrase or two words “Ale Ale”. How would you translate these words?
2. Roos writes the following sentence using the word USSLA as follows: Jag har icke något fördelas att förebrå mig - Jag har gjört hvarom och enom rätt och den tid jag sådant kunde den USSLA godt. How would you translate USSLA in this phrase? I would translate it as follows - I have nothing to apportion, to reproach myself for - I have treated each and everyone justly, [even] on the occasions I could have made them wretched. Can USEL be made into a verb?
Would appreciate your Swedish input.
Mvh,
Charles LaVine
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Re your 2nd question, you're right that usel and usla are different forms of the same word. Usla is the noun form that is used a) in plural, or b) with a definite article (like here).
I'd translate the latter part of the sentence as I have treated each and everyone justly, and when I could I also helped the wretched ones.
I'm a bit confused by the word fördelas, it doesn't make sense here. He may have intended to write förledes, meaning [in the] past, which fits a lot better.
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I know the meaning of Diary entries but Dairy entries must be something completely different!
Maybe different doors leading to the Dairy (= mejeri in Swedish)....
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Nils, we all know it's a typo.
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To All:
I hope I am not outwearing my welcome.
I need a translation of the following word in caps:
Klädd i full brudståt begåvade sig af att uppsöka pastor, att bliva förenade till ett KJÅTT/KJÖTT; ....
Roos is writing about a fellow Swedish emigrant soldier in Company D, 3rd Minnesota who deserted his Anna af Norrmanna at the, moment of their marriage and enlisted in the Company instead.
Mvh,
Charles LaVine
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Charles
Kjött - today's spelling KÖTT - means meat, flesh. This is an expression that in today's language is something like the two will become one.
Best regards,
Bibi
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Dressed in full bridal attire, they went off to search for a pastor, so they could be united into one flesh. (The modern spelling for kjött (flesh) is kött.)
Working out translations for those diary entries is quite interesting.
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Kära Svenskar,
I ask again your help with translating the following capitalized words in the following phrases:
1. - som jag en tid GÄLT OCH GÄLT för en dubbel person.
Is gält from att gälla = to count?
2. - och nu på morgonen UTPUKAT om hästar.
3. - och wore icke alls roade af sina nya tur att KANKA på hästar.
4. - kring Cornfields som warit förättad af Indianerne Squas, war rätt KURAD.
5. - och att den store Gudan fång HÄFVETS med Jacob en hel natt.
Any help translating is most appreciated.
Gud Jul och god fortsättningar in det nya Året
Charles
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Hello!
Could GÄLT be GÄLD (penningskuld- you owe someone money) We have GÄLDA which means betala= pay.??
1.as I for some time payd and payd as for two persons.../
4.KURAD, could be pay one´s addresses to, also impressive complimentary?
Only a guess!
Merry X-mas and a Happy New Year-2006!
//Anna
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3: and were not at all amused by their new luck? to ride? on horses.
4 around cornfields which has been made by Indian Squaws, was right/quite ??.
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Some reflections largely based on the SAOB (http://g3.spraakdata.gu.se/saob/) dictionary:
1. I think you're right about the word being GÄLLT (counted as), but having the entire sentence could make it easier to tell for sure.
2. PUKA means kettledrum, or to beat a such. UTPUKAT could possibly mean having beaten drums to carry out a message or signal, but it does seem far-fetched. Could the word be UTPEKAT instead, meaning having designated?
3. One meaning of the verb KANKA is to have an uncomfortable ride (on a horse or in a vehicle).
4. The verb KURA has to do with sitting still (like during a hunt), perhaps being bored in the process. On the other hand, there's a verb KUVA, and a person who is KUVAD is subdued.
5. This is a reference to Jacob's wrestling with God in Genesis chapter 32. A literal translation of the verb HÄFVA (nowadays HÄVA) would be to heave or toss.
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Charles
Just guessing.
3. (Like Anna-Carin) Kånka= Struggle.
4. Swenglish? Kurad= Cured.
I think this person has begun to loose some of his swedish.
Åke
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There is a older swedish word, kurerad, which means cured. Some people may very well have shortened kurerad to kurad. Especially in a English speaking environment.
However, cured does not fit very well in the text. Do you have more of the text before ...kring cornfields?
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To All:
Thanks again for your help.
You asked for the complete sentence for the GÄLT OCH GÄLT phrase . It herewith follows:
“Men hade samman usrsagt som Ringdal och så mycket mera som jag en tid GÄLT OCH GÄLT för en dubbel person, utom dess tog jag den enskilt fördelen i anspråk denna resan såsom jag hade waskning förhänder.”
The complete sentence where UTPUKAT was used was:
“Minnesota 3rd Riffles äro nu ochså förvändlade till Cavalleri och har nu på morgon UTPUKAT oss hästar, tvenne hvardera tills wi träffas Rgmt.”
I also misled you by misspelling “kurad”. Here is the complete sentence, properly spelled:
“Fene någon kring Cornfields som varit förrättad af Indianmernes Sqwas, war rätt KURIAD.”
Note the “I”.
Also can you help with the following, which I think is Swedish-ized, possibly to “hunt up”:
“Någonting vart som mina kamrater sällan kunna någonting fördelas UPPHUNTA, de tyckas icke hafva födgeni.”
And what is it to “sjunga Kung Orre”
Tack i förväg,
Charles
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Hello Charles La Vine
perhaps some help
UTPUKAT=equip=provide
Minestota 3rd Riffles are now transformed to Cavalleri and has now in the morning
provided us with horses, two each until we meet at the regement.
MVH
Yvonn Ekdahl
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Sounds like gält should be gällt (counted as) as assumed previously.
Your theory about upphunta sounds quite correct!
I googled for kung Orre (king Orre), and according to an early 20th century encyclopedia he was a mythological (Scandinavian) king. It also mentioned there's an old folk song or rhyme Kung Orre han skulle till gästabud fara. So, sjunga kung Orre may refer to singing that song. (I had trouble finding the lyrics online so I don't know for sure what it's about; the little I found suggests it may be a nursery rhyme.)
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To all:
Thanks again for your help, especially on “Kung Orre”.
I am again puzzling over several words and their proper translation. These words and the phrases they are used in are:
1. “jag icke under tåget blivit i RASEBUS sönderskakat på ryggen af ett sådant kreatur.”
2. “ehuru Gustaf Svensson som en RIKSHUSHÅLLARE knorrade öfver förmycket frikastigheten”
3. “The boys ville förse sig gratis härstädes med SPENDAGE hos sllongkeepers”
FYI: The 3rd Minnesota Regiment and its Company D or Scandinavian company has helped put down the Sioux Uprising in Minnesota, by Roos' account/diary at this point, and is now being return to the South to again fight there.
Much more to translate.
MVH
Charles
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RASEBUS - I have no idea, and the SAOB (Svenska Akademins OrdBok, the definitive dictionary of Swedish) doesn't have it either. Hopefully some one else can give an explanation! (It does sound a bit like Latin - perhaps one of our Latin scholars?)
RIKSHUSHÅLLARE - literally, householder of the realm; meaning that this guy Gustaf is going on about the generosity as if he was responsible for the nation's finances. It is a reference to our first Swedish king after the union era, Gustav Vasa, who is always portrayed as managing Sweden as if it was his own estate - and being very good at economizing (dissolution of the monasteries etc), indeed in older history books he is often referred to as a rikshushållare. You might be tempted to translate it with Lord High Steward (in the Scots manner) but this would give all the wrong ideas since this title (riksföreståndare) refers to the time before Sweden broke away from the union. Chancellor of the Exchequer (or whatever the American equivalent is) would be much better.
SPENDAGE - a gift which is akin to a fee, an expected gift for services rendered. In the old days even judges depended for their salary on stamp fees etc., and the dictionary says that spendage is a form of such fees. Today I think we'd regard it as protection money, but I don't think it was thought of as criminal at all in those days, merely a bit naughty if carried out in excess.
Ingela
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Thanks Ingela for your help. They cleared up and made better sense of the passages.
I have re-examined RASEBUS, and this is exactly what Roos wrote. The sense of his story was that he has ridden an ill-gaited horse from Ft Snelling (St Paul, MN) to Ft Abercrombie (closest present towns Wahpeton, ND and Breckenridge, MN) which was located in the very SE corner of North Dakota and back, at least 300 English miles. He finally trades horses with another soldier and is describing this soldier's view as to why he wasn't shaken to pieces. Could it be a Värmlanning uttryckt”?
Here is another word that I am puzzling and the sentence in which is used used:
1. som jag icke förmodar så skedde, men detta VAKTADT fann jag icke något smör till inventarium för vinter.
Charles
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Charles, the word should probably be oaktadt, which means in spite of, for all that etc.
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I agree with Elisabeth!
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I googled for rasebus and got three hits on German/Swiss pages. Then I tried some spelling variations and got nearly 300 hits for rasebos on pages in Holland. Maybe this is a long shot, but it might be worth a try finding out the word means in Dutch! German and related languages have had a noticeable impact on the Swedish language in the past.
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I've just had a thought! Could it it be that the word in question should be ' rustibus '? According to SAOB it was used to describe a person who is lively, agile . Nowadays it is most commonly used to describe a noicy and lively child.
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I wonder if RASEBUS could be some sort of euphemism for butt (behind)??
What is the Latin word for this part of the body?
Ingela
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Imgela,
Tried RASEBUS in several on-line Latin-English dictionaries but got no hits. It was a good suggestion though.
I also have wondered whether Roos was not describing an atonomical part like back bone or butt.
Charles
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For rasebus try in wild career.Rasa = rampage, bus can mean rampaging or mischief but is more likely added to ras to make a more impressive word. The analogy to rustibus(s), meaning a lively, high-spirited child, is clear.
This makes sense too.
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Elisabeth,
You were right. I looked again and it was oaktad.
I should have realized and remembered that Roos is writing pre spelling reform and therefore it could not be a v.
Charles
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Well, you never know how people spell during the 1800s. I think the first book with spelling rules was written in the 1840s by CJL Almqvist, and by then Carl Roos was a grown man.
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To All:
Thanks for the help.
I have another one for you, supposedly a proverb. Here it is:
med ett TEDD, blir tio SEDD, säger ordspråk.
Could it be equivalent to the English or American, a stitch in time, saves nine? That is sort of the sense that it is used. But the on-line SAOB - at least from A to Till, which I have now found, recognizes neither word.
Charles
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Charles, would it be possible for you to scan the sentences you are wondering about? It is probably much easier for us to help you if we can see the problems.